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Suspension and handling

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Barry-Sue

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Re: Suspension and handling
« Reply #15 on: March 26, 2011, 02:29:28 pm »
Hi jdw

We have the 2008 2350 and the first thing we did was have the alignment done.  The next thing was to have the Heavy Duty Bilstein shocks on the front only.  Finally, a year later we installed the blue ox tiger trac to eliminate the body sway from side to side.  What a huge improvement on the 2350.  We have the 2008 with slide and were in gust up to 50 mph and there were no issues.  The RV now drives like a typical F-150 with a cap.  This trac bar is different than the sway bar.  We have kept the original front and rear sway bars. We are very pleased with the ride and driveability.

 
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mciai2000

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Re: Suspension and handling
« Reply #16 on: March 26, 2011, 08:14:53 pm »
ok, you all have me very confused.  I had a very good idea of what I was going to do come spring when I pull the mh out of the pole barn. But now??? I was going to slap anti sway bars front and back. A job I think I can handle myself.  But now Barry-sue talks about a trac bar? What's the diff? and which is better? Are they the same thing. Ron or Billy how about a clarification here?

Thanks

David.
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billy

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Re: Suspension and handling
« Reply #17 on: March 26, 2011, 08:55:38 pm »
Quote from: billy on March 24, 2011, 04:50:08 pm
http://www.brazelsrv.com/

These are great people to deal with. Just purchased a Rear Trac-Bar and very pleased. Told them my rig was a 2011 and he check, recommended the trac-bar, I put it on and works great.


1) Shocks.
Shock absorbers are just that, as you your rig moves up and down the shocks help it from being a yoyo. Absorbs the bounce

2) Stabilizer Bars (Front & Rear)
Both front and rear are too small. After market is much larger (in diameter) helping keep your rig from side to side motion.

3) Steering Stabilizer
On the front, big & costly shock. Helps when hitting ruts, off the shoulder, quick movements of the rig. Not being a smart ass, but it’s a steering stabilizer. Usually mounts on a solid part of the frame and then to the front steering suspension.


4) Rear trac bar
Also the trac-bar mounts to the rear housing and then to the frame. When a big truck passes you, you do not have that rear side-to-side movement. It does not affect the up and down movement.

I hope this helps, I know I’ve probably forgot something. billy



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Ron Dittmer

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Re: Suspension and handling
« Reply #18 on: March 26, 2011, 09:44:40 pm »
I will take a stab at it too.

Sway/stabilizer bars reduce side-to-side swaying.  Like a pine tree would sway in a gusty wind storm.  Like a boat or a buoy rocks side-to-side in water.

A rear trac bar eliminates horizontal side-to-side motion.  The motion is caused from the rear leaf springs twisting.  That is why on a van style class B+/C there is no need for a front trac bar because the chassis does not have front leaf springs.

I can easily create the same motion with my little Ford Ranger pickup truck by standing close to the rear tailgate, pushing on the side in quick succession, getting it to shake it's butt sideways wildly.  I cannot do that with the front end because it has coil springs and the rest that goes with that type of suspension.
« Last Edit: March 26, 2011, 10:05:05 pm by ron.dittmer »
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mciai2000

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Re: Suspension and handling
« Reply #19 on: March 26, 2011, 09:49:21 pm »
Ron & Billy:

It seems to me to the anti-sway bars and trac bars do the basically the same thing.  Which one is the better one to start with?
DJM
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Ron Dittmer

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Re: Suspension and handling
« Reply #20 on: March 26, 2011, 10:01:48 pm »
Each addresses a different type of unwanted motion.  I advise to get both right from the start.  If you do just the sway bar, I understand it will have to be removed to install the trac bar, so just do both.....done once, done right.
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TomHanlon

Re: Suspension and handling
« Reply #21 on: March 27, 2011, 08:53:36 am »
http://www.blueox.us/TruCenter/pdfs/ClassC.pdf

Blue Ox write up for class C motorhomes in order that they should be done, unless you have lots of money and just want to throw money at the problem and have everything on at one time, which will at the very least fix just about everything. You may or may not want to use their products.
« Last Edit: March 27, 2011, 08:59:36 am by TomHanlon »
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lmichael

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Re: Suspension and handling
« Reply #22 on: May 10, 2011, 12:07:11 am »
After reading everyone's comments, I decided to replace the shocks and sway (anti sway for the purist) on my 2350.  It took me a full day to replace the stock shocks with Bilstein HD shocks front and back only because I kept having to "find" tools I just had.  Then I replaced the front and back sway bars with Hellwig anti sway bars, and that took me one day for the rear bar and a couple hours for the front bar.  It was a fairly simple installation except for a couple times when I over thought what I was doing.  After installing the front shocks, the test drive didn't show significant difference except for a stiffer ride.  The new rear shocks made a significant difference.  Then the test drive with the new rear sway bar was everything everyone has commented on in this post.  The front sway bar topped off a very satisfactory installation and test drive.  The difference is remarkable!  We're leaving next Monday on a long trip east, and I can't wait to experince the difference on the open road.  I did all the labor myself, and the total cost for these upgrades was $790.70.  The best price I found for the Bilstein HD shocks was through eshocks.com for $82.55 each with no shopping cost or tax.  The Hellwig front sway bar was $199.71, the rear $204.95 and shipping was $55.84 through sdtrucksprings.com.  All parts were received within 5 days of my order.  I'll get the steering stabilizer after this trip. I'm considering lowering the front tires to 70 psi from the recommended 75 to soften the ride a little.  Anybody have any thought about whether this is a good or bad idea?  Thanks for all your comments on the benefits of these upgrades that truly inspired me to undertake this project.
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billy

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Re: Suspension and handling
« Reply #23 on: May 10, 2011, 01:12:14 am »
Once we loaded the PC the front was a little loose, I lowered the front tires to 70psi and help a lot. Tomorrow we have it alignment. I worked at is shop doing the alignment. I don't feel like trying to get the dealer to "wink" so I can get a free alignment. Then next Tuesday we drive back to the coast, will see how it handles.
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TomHanlon

Re: Suspension and handling
« Reply #24 on: May 10, 2011, 07:29:34 am »
lmichael,
    On the way home from picking up the PC at the factory, I stopped and had it weight at a truck scale. When I got home I looked on the Michelin site and found their chart on my tires. It said that I could put 15 lbs less than what the door label said. Since then I have run with the pressure at 5 lbs less than the door, ie 70 lbs in the front and 75 in the rear. I feel this helps with the steering while keeping the gas mileage from dropping. I have been told that soft tires help ride and steering/traction while hard increases gas mileage.

    Do you know what the differences are between the Hellwig bars and the Roadmaster? I know the Roadmaster cost a lot more. I had my 2350 built on the E-450 for the stronger suspension. After reading all that has been said on here about changing the anti-sway bars, while at Camping World one day I had them put the Roadmaster rear anti-sway bar on. It did seem to help a little. Now I don't know the trucks are passing me until they are by my door and wake me up. heehee. I am running out of things to change on the PC, so one of these days I guess I might put the upgraded front bar on. Wonder if I could get away with the cheaper bar?
« Last Edit: May 10, 2011, 11:33:45 am by TomHanlon »
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Ron Dittmer

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Re: Suspension and handling
« Reply #25 on: May 10, 2011, 07:53:35 am »
The RV suspension shop that installed all my upgrades told me I should put 60psi in the rear tires and 65 in the front tires.  I followed his advise for a weekend get-away to find the handling great and the ride very comfortable, but I wasn't comfortable with it because the tires looked underinflated.  I run with 65 in the rears and 70 in the fronts since.  Funny that the tires still look underinflated.  I have to put in 75/80 psi all around for the tires to look right, but the ride gets uncomfortable, and the handling a bit compromised.

I don't have a slide out so my rig is a bit lighter than the typical 2350.  Maybe that is how I get by with a little less psi.

Comparing Helwig to Roadmaster bars.  They are both made using the same steel, and have the same diameter.  The Roadmaster mounting method is very different.  It involve cast aluminum clamp-downs for mounting points for the end links.  I can see why it costs a lot more.  I just don't know if the Roadmaster bars are over-engineered.  Look close at this picture of my front bar.

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bobander

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Re: Suspension and handling
« Reply #26 on: May 10, 2011, 11:27:35 am »
To add further info to Ron's post regarding Roadmaster front bar mounting.  I added the Roadmaster bars to my 2010 E450.  The front bar has a different mount for newer years than what Ron shows for his 2007.  As the picture shows, Ford added a mounting point for the factory swaybar end link.  Roadmaster uses the factory end link making the install easier and cleaner.  I believe this applies to 2009 and newer E350 and E450, check with Roadmaster to be sure - or just look under your rig to see if you have the factory swaybar endlink shown in the picture.

Bob

« Last Edit: May 10, 2011, 11:49:25 am by bobander »
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Ron Dittmer

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Re: Suspension and handling
« Reply #27 on: May 10, 2011, 12:05:00 pm »
Oh, I REALLY like that Bobander.  Much cleaner and surely more reliable in the long run.
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billy

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Re: Suspension and handling
« Reply #28 on: May 10, 2011, 06:02:08 pm »
Ron, I've seen the picture of your steering stabilizer. Would you be able to take a few more pictures of the stabilizer. Maybe one of each end? Would like to see how it's mounted. Would appreciate it. Had the rig aligned and felt a small improvement. They worked on the camber and got with-in factory spec, but on the high end for the camber. So I opted for the off set bushings to bring the camber down closer to a 1/4.  billy
« Last Edit: May 10, 2011, 06:19:20 pm by billy »
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Ron Dittmer

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Re: Suspension and handling
« Reply #29 on: May 11, 2011, 12:56:44 am »
Quote from: billy on May 10, 2011, 06:02:08 pm
Would you be able to take a few more pictures of the stabilizer. Maybe one of each end? Would like to see how it's mounted.
I emailed you what I had on-hand.....to your mac.com address.
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