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Five and a half years later...................

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Ron Dittmer

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Re: Five and a half years later...................
« Reply #15 on: March 04, 2019, 01:27:47 pm »
Quote from: Rick Leddon on March 04, 2019, 12:40:34 pm
Ron, thanks for the info on the flaking seats. I will contact Paul's and get the seats reskinned. Has to be better and cheaper then having them done custom.
You are welcome.

I don't know if Paul's even sells vinyl seat skins any longer.  At any price, I would not consider them.  Ask about his cloth and top grain (also called full grain) leather.  Bonded leather is actually worse than vinyl because unlike vinyl of recent years, it is guaranteed to flake.  At least with vinyl, it is a hit-or-miss risk of getting a poor product.

Our vinyl interior is 12 years old and still perfect.  Some years later we bought a new 3rd captain seat to replace the original barrel chair by the entry door, and then some years after that we replaced our cloth dinette cushions with mem-foam vinyl.....all from Paul's Seating during questionable years.  But I recalled in both instances, they were worried about old stock material on-hand.  The captain seat is Morning Mist Gray and the dinette cushions are Sagemint Green.  Paul's actually had to get the old stock green material from Phoenix.  They had enough old green on-hand to make the dinette cushions.  We seem to have dodged that bullet.

Go with real leather or cloth and you will do well.  Understandably so, Paul's Seating is "touchy" about complaints of the vinyl failure.  To get what you need, I would not mention it.  Just call and order his new stuff and be done.  If you "vent", you may break communication as I read has happened to others.
« Last Edit: March 04, 2019, 01:45:25 pm by Ron Dittmer »
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Volkemon

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Re: Five and a half years later...................
« Reply #16 on: March 04, 2019, 01:58:35 pm »
Quote from: Rick Leddon on March 04, 2019, 12:40:34 pm
Ron, thanks for the info on the flaking seats. I will contact Paul's and get the seats reskinned. Has to be better and cheaper then having them done custom.

Not sure about your area, but here in FLA we have a BUNCH of retirees and good weather. Makes for a good labor pool. Mrs V is in the process of finding a local guy to re-do our front seats, there are a few (read:many) upholstery people around.  In the process of getting prices now. There is a 'Pauls' sticker on our seat, but they have yet to return a message. Supplying new seats to the industry is a LOT less trying than dealing with small orders from fussy owners, so i can understand.

Will report back with seat info, we really need them to be gray. Or black. NOT beige. They are in great shape, too bad the color is now wrong.
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Ron Dittmer

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    • My 2007 2350 Phoenix Cruiser
  • OwnPC: Yes
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  • PurchDate: June 2007
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  • IntColor: Cherry Green&Gray
  • ExtColor: Full Body Gray
  • Location: N/E Illinois
Re: Five and a half years later...................
« Reply #17 on: March 05, 2019, 12:38:01 pm »
I worked with Paul's Seating in the past when ordering our 3rd captain seat.  It was difficult for me to order direct from them.  I recall Phoenix getting involved being my spokesperson after a tough start.  Then once we got moving, Phoenix wasn't needed any longer.  Our dinette cushions was handled completely through Phoenix so that was painless for me.

Maybe working with Paul's starts with a phone call from Phoenix.  Then you can get things moving.

But Volkemon's strategy sounds really good...work with a local resource.
« Last Edit: March 05, 2019, 12:39:43 pm by Ron Dittmer »
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sailors35

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Re: Five and a half years later...................
« Reply #18 on: March 05, 2019, 05:12:53 pm »
I have owned sailboats for over 30 years, and just like my PC in each case one has to delineate between products provided by vendors and the parts actually built by the end builder.  In effect these things are a combination of many parts being brought together.  Not a justification for poor quality control, just an observation.
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dogyard

Re: Five and a half years later...................
« Reply #19 on: March 05, 2019, 05:21:58 pm »
After finding that local upholstery shops wanted $750 per seat for recovering and then trying in vain to get Paul's to return a call/email for a few weeks I turned to superior-seats.com, just down the road from PC factory.  I ordered new leather/vinyl seats from them that have the same seat pan as Paul's.  I picked them up and had them installed at PC while I was having other work done - they created QUITE a stir with many workers stopping by to see them as they are so much sleeker than what Paul's has available.  I could only upload the attached pdf but you can see the seats I now have installed.  My wife is DELIGHTED to not be "sitting in a hole" any longer - these are firm and supportive seats!
« Last Edit: March 05, 2019, 05:23:36 pm by dogyard »
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Volkemon

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Re: Five and a half years later...................
« Reply #20 on: March 06, 2019, 06:43:17 am »
Quote from: sailors35 on March 05, 2019, 05:12:53 pm
I have owned sailboats for over 30 years, and just like my PC in each case one has to delineate between products provided by vendors and the parts actually built by the end builder.  In effect these things are a combination of many parts being brought together.  Not a justification for poor quality control, just an observation.

THIS!   ↑↑↑

Quote from: Ron Dittmer on March 05, 2019, 12:38:01 pm
But Volkemon's strategy sounds really good...work with a local resource.

Sounded great....

Yeah.... quotes are coming in around 750-800 PER SEAT to reupholster.  :beg :'( The 'pillow on pillow' design basically makes it so they have to rip it apart, copy the pieces, and reassemble. So...MORE work than building it new.  :help  OK....that was an education.  (nod)

Not to mention that when we are done...the seats still look like 1980's styling..  (WH)  For that money...

https://shop4seats.com/rv-furniture/rv-captain-chairs/all-captain-chairs/de-leon-rv-captain-chair.html

So.... now we are looking at ~$1700 for two new captains chairs. Ultimate Leather (vinyl)  Charcoal grey, mine (drivers) with lumbar and extra seat spring support (add ~$150 to the base price) and Mrs V's (passenger) will have the power (no manual available.. >( ) footrest. Mrs V is about 5 foot tall, (152cm for the rest of the world..) and her constant problem is dangling legs off the seat. In the bus we had a small stool for her feet. Pricey upgrade, at $350, but hey... she is MORE than worth it.  heartshower
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dogyard

Re: Five and a half years later...................
« Reply #21 on: March 06, 2019, 11:02:46 am »
Quick note - check with PC techs about the shop4seats replacement. I learned they were not compatible with the factory seat platforms and would need new pedestals, etc installed. On the other hand the Superior Seating seats I purchased were plug and play.
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Volkemon

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Re: Five and a half years later...................
« Reply #22 on: March 06, 2019, 11:20:00 am »
Quote from: dogyard on March 06, 2019, 11:02:46 am
Quick note - check with PC techs about the shop4seats replacement. I learned they were not compatible with the factory seat platforms and would need new pedestals, etc installed. On the other hand the Superior Seating seats I purchased were plug and play.

The only 'non compatible' was in the lack pedestal seat belt mounting in my existing ones per shop4seats. They said I would need new pedestals because of that. Otherwise they will fit that 11x14 pattern that is on mine.

I am pretty sure I can weld up some seat belt mounts on my pedestals.  roflol  I have a few roll cages and rail buggies in my past..  I would see how it could be a 'stopper' for the average owner, however.

Checking out the Superior Seats site now.   tymote    Which did you get?


EDIT -

Well, went to their site.... no pricing? There is a 'pricing' button, but appears to do nothing. Even tried another computer thinking it might be this antique holding things up...  Tried calling, but went to a voicemail.

I am guessing you went with one of the ISS seats to avoid the pedestal problem....

http://superior-seats.com/Executive-ISS
« Last Edit: March 06, 2019, 11:50:17 am by Volkemon »
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dogyard

Re: Five and a half years later...................
« Reply #23 on: March 06, 2019, 12:28:56 pm »
We chose the "Excalibur" seats and had them made in two-tone leather with contrasting stitching.  The seating surfaces are all leather and backs have vinyl although I can't tell them apart.  We were going to get the upgraded springs but Ryan Kindt - (574) 389-9011 x211 or ryan@superior-seats.com suggested that would be too stiff even though I'm pushing 1/8 ton.....

I've tried to attach another photo, hopefully this comes through
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dogyard

Re: Five and a half years later...................
« Reply #24 on: March 06, 2019, 12:37:52 pm »
Here's the seats after install at PC factory.  Mounted on factory bases and passenger seat swivels as before.  Driver's seat has electric base from previous seats so no extra parts needed to install.

FYI - they cost $675/each as built. Since I picked them up I avoided their shipping costs.
« Last Edit: March 06, 2019, 12:43:56 pm by dogyard »
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Ron Dittmer

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Re: Five and a half years later...................
« Reply #25 on: March 06, 2019, 12:50:47 pm »
dogyard,
There is only one thing that I can say about that.
 2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2  2o2
I only hope your vinyl back-sides don't flake.  I would have paid more for 100% leather.

Volkemon,
I strongly advise against any kind of vinyl seating.  You don't know when or where the vinyl originated from.  Go with real leather (not bonded leather) or go with cloth.  Vinyl is too risky.  Phoenix has avoided it since the problem was discovered.  You should too.
« Last Edit: March 06, 2019, 12:58:41 pm by Ron Dittmer »
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Volkemon

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Re: Five and a half years later...................
« Reply #26 on: March 06, 2019, 01:39:05 pm »
They do look fine!  Are the seatbelts attached to the bases?  I dont see the 'Integrated Seatbelt System'  (ISS) on the seats...   


Ron, thanks. I do respect the warning, but cloth is NOT an option. Does not fit our lifestyle.  Yes, there have been problems in the past with vinyl.  Buy cheapo get cheapo.

Personally, I have yet to have ANY problem with it.  Done a little work with it.  It is a fairly well proven product on the market, and used many places.  I have bought the cheap stuff from JoAnns fabrics, and had no problems with it for years in the florida sun as a headliner and trim material.  The marine grade that is bought from the upholstery shop is even better.

I have not one piece of peeling vinyl in my 13 year old camper. Seems like the peeling is a rather limited exception, rather than a rule. 26 out of the 1265 members here have participated in a poll to say they had peeling. 2%.  Lets say only 1/2 participated... that would be 4%, or 1 in 25.  I dont mind those odds.


Should they peel, you will have the first TWO "I Told You So" 's  and I will be warning people with you. But for now, it is the only practical option.

 
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dogyard

Re: Five and a half years later...................
« Reply #27 on: March 06, 2019, 02:31:53 pm »
I didn't get the ISS as these just use the standard seat belt attachment that bolts right on to the seat pan. Doug even had an "extra" seat belt bracket for the passenger side to replace my original that had cracked plastic cover.
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Sarz272000

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Re: Five and a half years later...................
« Reply #28 on: March 06, 2019, 06:21:44 pm »
Dog yard

Nice seats! Classy and comfortable!

Do they have a sofa replacement too?

Ron S
« Last Edit: March 06, 2019, 06:32:02 pm by Sarz272000 »
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Volkemon

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Re: Five and a half years later...................
« Reply #29 on: March 06, 2019, 06:29:15 pm »
Quote from: dogyard on March 06, 2019, 02:31:53 pm
I didn't get the ISS as these just use the standard seat belt attachment that bolts right on to the seat pan. Doug even had an "extra" seat belt bracket for the passenger side to replace my original that had cracked plastic cover.

Nice.   I was suspecting there was an easier answer. Those look great.
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