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PC 3100 and PC 2351 Owners ... purchase dilemma

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SpiderWebb

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PC 3100 and PC 2351 Owners ... purchase dilemma
« on: November 26, 2015, 04:49:09 pm »
Happy Thanksgiving.  We are soon to be first time RV owners and we’ve landed on Phoenix Cruiser for many reasons including this helpful forum.  I’ve been monitoring the PC forum for the past 6-8 months so I feel like I know a number of you!  I looked at past threads but didn’t find this topic.  Here is our dilemma.  Our initial focus was on the 2351 (25 ft.) for the drivability and maneuverability, etc.  We then briefly considered the 2552 … but after visiting PC in Elkhart we lit up on the 3100 (31 ft.) as it checked all of our boxes for both needs and wants (livability, storage, fixed dinette & sofa, larger bathroom, etc.).  Note, it will only be the two of us and our purpose for the RV is to explore the US and Canada …with an emphasis on National Parks.  Most trips will be 2 weeks with a few longer trips that could take us out 3-4 weeks.  We are not interested in towing a vehicle so this would be both our traveling residence as well as our primary means of transportation.  I could see us on rare occasion renting a car in certain situations (i.e. in larger cities, etc.) …but that would be the exception.  So the question of the day is …generally would the additional 6 feet in length of the 3100 present challenges often and/or significant enough in terms of:  1. parking in towns; 2. driving in towns and/or National Parks; 3. parking in turn-outs for viewing scenery, etc.; 4. parking in tighter spaces in RV campgrounds… to compel us to reconsider the 2351 and its shorter length?  Knowing this is somewhat subjective, we appreciate all opinions and perspectives …particularly those who have gone from 25 ft. to 31 ft. RV’s… or the other way around, or those who own either of these two models. Thanks for your consideration.     Steve
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Doneworking

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Re: PC 3100 and PC 2351 Owners ... purchase dilemma
« Reply #1 on: November 26, 2015, 05:43:09 pm »
The questions you ask are the very reasons why we own a 2350, the just a foot smaller model to the 2351.  Candidly, I can't personally imagine trying to hassle 31 feet of motor home in not many but most of the places we go, including national parks, BLM, NF, etc.  And pulling over to view something would be just a bridge too far for me in anything that long.  Others may share a very different opinion and experience, but we own a smallish Class C because of all those considerations.  AND, I certainly can't imagine doing that kind of exploring without a towed vehicle with a 31 footer.  Just our experience and opinion.

Paul
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BuffaloRose

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Re: PC 3100 and PC 2351 Owners ... purchase dilemma
« Reply #2 on: November 26, 2015, 07:33:50 pm »
We downsized from a 30 foot class A because we hated the hassle of towing but neither were we happy moving about and sight seeing in our 30 footer without towing.  Just takes too much space to pull over, especially in crowded areas.  Many times we wanted to pull over to see a view but just couldn't park. Many nfs, NP or state parks limit size to 27 feet or less. We briefly owned a 27 footer b+ that could not comfortably park in some small downtown areas, i.e., st augustine Florida, Jackson hole, Yellowstone and the list goes on.  We are VERY happy with our 2350.  We can pull off on the roadside very easily.  We did rent a car for last years trip to Acadia.  The roads and traffic in the park we not conducive for driving in even the 24 footer.  There are sacrifices on every motor home choice.  You give up something to get something.  Oh yes, we rarely worry about stopping at macdonalds for a quick lunch.  Most places can accommodate our 24 footer, even dairy queen😀
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Ron Dittmer

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Re: PC 3100 and PC 2351 Owners ... purchase dilemma
« Reply #3 on: November 27, 2015, 02:22:08 pm »
I completely agree with BuffaloRose and Doneworking.  We have owned our 2350 for 8.5 years to date.  We exclusively stay in national parks, monuments, forests, BLMs, and state parks.  When not in those places, we stay in Walmarts and rest areas.  We travel once a year for 2 to 4 weeks to such places.  The 2350 will work in all places mentioned except during peak season when even a regular vehicle parking spot is hard to find.  Because we like to explore down roads that are not friendly for a motor home, we tow our Jeep Liberty.  I think off season (after the kids are back in school) the 2350 will work well for getting around.  Given the 2351 is only one foot longer, I don't think it will make big difference, just a minor to moderate difference.  6 feet longer is another story.  It is remarkable the impact just a couple feet makes in getting around.
« Last Edit: November 27, 2015, 02:23:46 pm by ron.dittmer »
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dickreid1

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Re: PC 3100 and PC 2351 Owners ... purchase dilemma
« Reply #4 on: November 27, 2015, 02:45:11 pm »
Steve,

Go with smaller.

After 95,000 miles in a 24ft Sprinter, our need for "elder comfort" lead us to having a regular bed.   I really miss all the agility, parkability, turnability, accessabilty, etc. that we used to have.  Trips  now are more park and sit rather than poke around all day then look for a place for the night.  A lot of the fun and freedom is gone.

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SpiderWebb

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Re: PC 3100 and PC 2351 Owners ... purchase dilemma
« Reply #5 on: November 27, 2015, 03:00:41 pm »
All:  I can't thank you enough for your candid feedback and counsel. Having never done this ...your perspective has great value.  We will plan to hike back up to Elkhart to spend more time in the 2351 with the goal of making that footprint work for us... rather than be seduced by the creature comforts of the 3100.

Steve
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AG6MM

Re: PC 3100 and PC 2351 Owners ... purchase dilemma
« Reply #6 on: November 27, 2015, 09:50:47 pm »
Steve,

My wife and I have a 3100.  We like it a lot. We travel with four small dogs and have pretty much mastered "the dance."

I do all the driving and since we've owned the rig, we have RVed about 12,000 miles. I have never had an issue with the situations you outlined. The truck mirrors and the rear view camera make driving the 3100 a breeze. With the V-10 Triton engine, our MPG is quite reasonable.

We've had our rig about a year and a half.  In that time, there have been some mechanical issues but the factory took care of them with no hassle.  On our last road trip, we went to the factory for some "adjustments" and were happy with how we were treated.

Our layout consists of two twin beds (each across the aisle from each other), a dinette, and a dual recliner sofa in the slide-out.

In the cab, I have a ham radio, a CB radio, a ScanGauge, and a large screen GPS. We tow a Honda CR-V and with a Blue Ox towing setup, that is also a breeze.

Would we buy another Phoenix Cruiser?  Yes.  Would it be a 3100? Yes.

If I can answer any more questions, please feel free to email me:  travelmutts@gmail.com

Stu
St. Helena, CA
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GoPhoenix

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Re: PC 3100 and PC 2351 Owners ... purchase dilemma
« Reply #7 on: November 28, 2015, 08:47:13 am »
Our 3100 was not a problem.  Just depends on how you travel.  We rarely stayed in national or state parks, almost exclusively in private parks with all the amenities.  Have never stayed in a Walmart or rest area.  We usually stayed for several days, sometimes a month, and always made heavy use of our tow car (pic).  We first had a 2900 (not made now) and traded for the 3100 which fit our style better.  If there was one “best” model (or even one “best” RV style), everyone would own the same one.  Buy what fits your style of travel.  The only time we did not take a tow car was on our Alaska trip and Route 66 trip which worked out for the best: http://www.mytripjournal.com/HistoricRoute66.  We loved the 3100 and never regretted the choice.
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campmuch

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Re: PC 3100 and PC 2351 Owners ... purchase dilemma
« Reply #8 on: November 28, 2015, 07:50:33 pm »
You have a lot of advice but if you are not going to tow I would not go for the 31. I have owned 24, 28, and several 36 before downsizing to the 2551. would not go larger unless I was going to tow.
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JimInVA

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Re: PC 3100 and PC 2351 Owners ... purchase dilemma
« Reply #9 on: November 29, 2015, 11:20:12 am »
Steve,

I also have the 2351 in my sights... and am soaking up all of the information that's being posted.  Many thanks for the sharing of each person's perspective.  It certainly is helping define my own.

Jim
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Bruce

Re: PC 3100 and PC 2351 Owners ... purchase dilemma
« Reply #10 on: November 29, 2015, 03:38:01 pm »
I can’t resist sharing some thoughts, even if they have already been expressed here by others.

When we first became RVers many years ago, we didn’t ever want to tow anything behind our motorhome.  But it didn’t take us long to change our minds.  On many trips having the freedom to just go with the motorhome until we found a new place to camp was very desirable. 

But, occasionally we wanted to stay in one location for several days and explore the vicinity in several directions from our campsite.  It became a pain to breakdown camp at least somewhat in order to drive away in the motorhome for the day.  That’s when we realized how nice it would be to leave the motorhome in the set up campsite and drive around in a small vehicle.

Since those days we’ve owned several motorhomes and have always been ready to take along the towed car.  It is much easier to do this than we had imagined when we were new to this lifestyle.  Over the years we have met many RVers that have gone through the same learning process.

So, my recommendation is to buy the model of motorhome that you will be comfortable using as a camping unit and have the ability to tow when you might want.

Our first PC was a 2350, but we found that the bed and bath areas were too small for our comfort level.  The 2552 that we’ve been using for more than two years fits us perfectly.  We almost always tow the Honda CR-V to use as described above and also to bring more camping gear with us on trips.

--Bruce
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TomHanlon

Re: PC 3100 and PC 2351 Owners ... purchase dilemma
« Reply #11 on: November 29, 2015, 04:53:14 pm »
Ditto what Bruce said.
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SpiderWebb

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Re: PC 3100 and PC 2351 Owners ... purchase dilemma
« Reply #12 on: November 29, 2015, 06:04:59 pm »
The perspectives and experience of you long-time RV'ers is invaluable and we are very appreciative of all the thoughtful input.  From our perspective, we would certainly not go smaller than what would meet first ...all our needs ...followed by as many of our "wants" as possible.  The trade-off for us is how many additional "wants" in terms of livability would we forgo in exchange for drivability and maneuverability, etc.  We will take the time and expense to go back to Phoenix Cruiser in Elkhart and spend time with the 2351 to ensure that it does meet our needs ...then compare how many of our wants it provides compared to the 3100.  Although I do have an initial aversion to towing ...it is something that we will investigate to understand the ease of doing so.  This entire thread absolutely confirms why this Phoenix Cruiser forum community is so important and valuable to our decision to go with a new PC.  We plan to get this decision made and our new PC ordered by the end of January (weather permitting for travel to Elkhart) ...and I will report back to all with our final decision.  Our best to you all and our thanks for your consideration.  Steve & Jennifer Webb
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Pax

Re: PC 3100 and PC 2351 Owners ... purchase dilemma
« Reply #13 on: November 29, 2015, 09:22:55 pm »
Steve / Jennifer:

Joni and I have neither model you are considering (we have a 2552), but I don't think you mentioned if you previously owned an RV and if so, if you ever towed.  Our PC was our first RV and (obviously) the first time towing.  We went back and forth about whether to tow or not, and whether renting in certain cities would be more beneficial.  We opted to tow and are glad we did.  It didn't take that long to streamline the process of setting up at a campground/park and conversely buttoning things up, however we now know we would not want to do it on a regular basis to go sightseeing, the grocery, the RV parts store, the restaurant, etc etc.  Also, aside from the setup and tear down, there is the additional gas expended in a low MPG vehicle using the RV for those side trips. One other benefit of towing for us has been the ability to stop much quicker, since there is an auxiliary braking system in the tow vehicle.  This comes in handy much more often than I would have imagined.  Last positive aspect of towing is the additional space you have in the towed vehicle for 'stuff'.  We generally keep beach-gear, chairs and our home-made dog anchors in there which is helpful given the finite storage space in a class B+.

The down-side to towing (for us) has been additional gas expended while normally towing (and especially uphill) and the additional expense for the gear (aux braking system, tow bar, brake/turn signal system, baseplate, etc.)  I guess we should include wear and tear (tires) but no additional mileage racks up on the odometer.

Lastly, we've really become proficient at connecting and disconnecting our tow vehicle.  Takes us about 2 minutes.  This is with a Blue Ox tow bar/baseplate on a Ford Edge LTD.

Of course, the towing option is always available to you later if you find you'd really like to have it.

- Mike
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Ron Dittmer

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Re: PC 3100 and PC 2351 Owners ... purchase dilemma
« Reply #14 on: November 29, 2015, 10:23:42 pm »
Mike (Pax), you said it so well.
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