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A New Banging Sound After Year #6 - In The B+ Cap Area

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Ron Dittmer

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Re: A New Banging Sound After Year #6 - Dead Center In The Headliner Area
« Reply #15 on: September 09, 2013, 03:37:55 pm »
I understand now and know what to look for.  If that's all it is, maybe I can wedge in an old rubber computer mouse pad, keeping it in place with carpet tape in there and be done with it.  Thanks a bunch ragoodsp!
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Sparky

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Re: A New Banging Sound After Year #6 - Dead Center In The Headliner Area
« Reply #16 on: September 09, 2013, 06:28:04 pm »
good pic Ron,,,, I'm in storage, but might go out next week will drive around if I do.....  Ok I can see the gutter rail where the cap is going to be set,,, want they have to fix some support at the cut area and where the liner and shelving goes?  I can imagine the cap being placed on the cab, liner in place maybe some caulking, then screwing it down like some of the guys have mentioned.  Wonder how hard to take the bottom of the two cabinets or Tv cabinet out?  Maybe you could see the screw line where they attached the cap.  Hate for you have to take out that headliner  ouch what a job,,,,,, Might want to call the PC factory get some suggestions...   good luck and be carful around that metal edge
sparky
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Ron Dittmer

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Re: A New Banging Sound After Year #6 - Dead Center In The Headliner Area
« Reply #17 on: September 09, 2013, 06:41:35 pm »
I feel very comfortable dropping the headliner as long as I can leave the rearward end of it attached.  I hope to drop the front and I might be able to swing it around 180 degrees rearward to expose the original sheet metal and all.  I'll have Irene drive while I look, listen, and feel around.  And yes I will be careful with that jagged sheet metal.
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Sparky

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Re: A New Banging Sound After Year #6 - Dead Center In The Headliner Area
« Reply #18 on: September 09, 2013, 06:54:12 pm »
I hope that's it    don't forget pictures in case  I have to do this (fingers crossed haha) or someone else
sparky
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bobander

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Re: A New Banging Sound After Year #6 - Dead Center In The Headliner Area
« Reply #19 on: September 12, 2013, 05:32:35 pm »
Quote from: ron.dittmer on September 09, 2013, 11:51:46 am
Anyone yet perform that test in driving their rig and feel for gasket-to-roof movement?

Ron,

Reporting on my test drive today from Taos to Chama, road was rough enough in places to give a good test.  I put my fingers between the cap and cab roof along the side and as far forward as I could reach.  I didn't feel any measurable relative motion between the two surfaces, if I really concentrated I thought I was detecting some movement but it was so small it was probably my imagination.

If you are detecting significant relative movement, then that sounds like the problem - loose screws popping with movement.  Keep us posted on what you find.

Bob
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Ron Dittmer

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Re: A New Banging Sound After Year #6 - Dead Center In The Headliner Area
« Reply #20 on: September 12, 2013, 06:21:52 pm »
Thanks Bob for reporting in with that data.  I think it is best I go "deep" regardless of where the noise is coming from.  I'll plan on adding many more and better fasteners as perviously covered.

If only I could work 40 hour weeks to have the time to get into it.
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Ron Dittmer

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Re: A New Banging Sound After Year #6 - Dead Center In The Headliner Area
« Reply #21 on: September 13, 2013, 02:44:19 pm »
Before I start digging into this, I thought I'd give Kermit a call and see if he had any advise for me.  So I got to talking with him on the phone today and glad I did.

First of all, Kermit really wanted me to drive the rig there, but a three hour drive one way meant an all day ordeal and a day off work, neither which I can afford to do right now.  So we discussed my situation over the phone of which he had some very good pointers for me.

It was interesting to learn that Phoenix had not seen any B+ caps separate from the Ford roof since the earliest model years 1999-2000 of which a change in their production process had addressed that.  So he wonders if my cap is simply flexing, not separating.  He suggested I stand outside and "palm" the B+ cap upward to see if I can actually lift it up.  If something failed, the B+ cap should lift up.

Kermit also mentioned that if there was a failure, I should be getting water dripping down from the headliner when driving in the rain.  Since I do not have water dripping, he thinks I might be okay.  But check for separation to be sure.

Kermit also mentioned the decorative round bead between the B+ cap and roof is only decorative.  It has a 1" tab that secures it but it does not seal out rain water.  There is another much better gasket sandwiched in between cap and roof.

As far as the banging is concerned, Kermit had a a few other customers complain about the same thing.  As ragoodsp mentioned, the Ford metal roof is flopping around.  Kermit's fix is simple and easy.  He said they screw in a self tapping 3" long screw into the floor of each glass door side cabinet to draw the metal roof upward to secure it.

This weekend I'll be following Kermit's advice and see what I find and resolve.  Hopefully my issues are minor with fast easy fixes.  If not, I'll either dig deeper myself or I may give in and drive over to the factory for the day.  I'll report back as to my findings.

I've spoken to Kermit but just a few times via phone and really enjoy talking "PCs" with him.  I greatly appreciate his interest in my troubles and his desire to resolve them for me.  My rig is six years old yet I am treated like a new-bee owner.

« Last Edit: September 13, 2013, 02:52:53 pm by ron.dittmer »
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lmichael

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Re: A New Banging Sound After Year #6 - Dead Center In The Headliner Area
« Reply #22 on: September 13, 2013, 06:24:55 pm »
You're right, Ron--as we've said over and over on this forum, the PC after sale service is almost beyond belief.  When I drove into the factory unannounced with the noise in my 2350 cap, they immediately started working on finding the problem and fixing it.  It took several hours and 2 people working non-stop until they did get it fixed.  When I tell people about this experience, they're amazed I didn't have to make an appointment and wait several days to get it fixed.   
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Ron Dittmer

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Re: A New Banging Sound After Year #6 - Dead Center In The Headliner Area
« Reply #23 on: September 27, 2013, 08:39:17 am »
Good News For Me.

I finally had some time to apply the advise from Kermit (and one of you) and it solved my banging.  Last night, inside each front cabinet, I screwed 3 flat head screws through the cabinet floor into the original Ford steel roof and tightened them as snug as the cabinet floors would allow with only a little dimple/distortion.  While inside the cabinets, I tightened every screw I could find.  Some I was able to make more snug.

I drove our PC to work this morning and the banging is gone.  At lunch I'll be driving the rig to the IL-EPA smog test station.

Since I questioned my cap-to-roof interconnetion, I followed Kermit's advise and palmed the B+ cap upward.  There was "Zero" effect, no movement at all so I conclude my cap is mounted on good.  That vibration movement I feel in between cap and roof while driving, I will consider normal.  Kermit also said that if my cap was loose, rain water would be dripping from the headliner while driving in a rain storm, and that has never happened.

So I think all is well, done with this thread.  Now it's off to looking into some other noises in back.  I think my microwave oven could use some looking into, maybe pulling it out and adding some adhesive back pads to minimize and dampen any movement and/or rubbing.  I also need to get to my converted 5-to-3 drawer galley cabinet, installing push button latches, the kind used on cabinet doors in other brand motor homes.  The 5 magnets per drawer didn't keep them closed during the worst of circumstances.

Thanks again all for your insights & experience related to my banging.....And Thank You Kermit!
« Last Edit: September 27, 2013, 09:43:25 am by ron.dittmer »
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Bob Mahon

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Re: A New Banging Sound After Year #6 - In The B+ Cap Area
« Reply #24 on: September 27, 2013, 09:34:39 am »
Hey Ron,
How about a photo showing where you installed the screws?
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TomHanlon

Re: A New Banging Sound After Year #6 - In The B+ Cap Area
« Reply #25 on: September 27, 2013, 09:38:14 am »
Ron I am glad you fixed the problem without having to terrorize the cab. Kermit is so helpfull. How many other companies do you know where the owner is so helpfull? Not many I bet.
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Ron Dittmer

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Re: A New Banging Sound After Year #6 - In The B+ Cap Area
« Reply #26 on: September 27, 2013, 09:43:58 am »
Quote from: Bob Mahon on September 27, 2013, 09:34:39 am
Hey Ron, How about a photo showing where you installed the screws?
I can do that!
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Ron Dittmer

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Re: A New Banging Sound After Year #6 - In The B+ Cap Area
« Reply #27 on: September 27, 2013, 09:44:58 am »
Quote from: TomHanlon on September 27, 2013, 09:38:14 am
Kermit is so helpfull. How many other companies do you know where the owner is so helpfull? Not many I bet.
In Total Agreement Tom!
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Ron Dittmer

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Re: A New Banging Sound After Year #6 - In The B+ Cap Area
« Reply #28 on: September 27, 2013, 10:13:53 pm »
The Tools I Used.
The flat head screws are 1.5" long


This done inside both cabinets.  The screws are 3" in from the cabinet opening.
Today I added a 4th screw more forward (seen in the pic) to help anchor the front corners of the cabinetry better, stabilizing the TV better too.
I really don't know if the cabinets are keeping the Ford roof from banging, or the tight connection to the Ford roof helps stabilize the cabinetry to prevent the banging.  Either way the banging is gone and the cabinets and TV don't bounce nearly as much on bumps as they did prior.


Irene drove the PC on a local bumpy road while I watched and listened.  During the test drive, I learned our microwave was making noises because the 6 perimeter mounting screws had come loose.  I tightened them up and the microwave got very quiet.  Now I hear the heat shield under the motor home making noise, but I don't have any desire to do something about that one.....at least not yet. :)

Things have come a long way in just a few hours work.  I am very happy.  Now on to my drawer latches.
« Last Edit: September 27, 2013, 10:25:27 pm by ron.dittmer »
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Bob Mahon

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Re: A New Banging Sound After Year #6 - In The B+ Cap Area
« Reply #29 on: September 27, 2013, 10:35:28 pm »
That's great, Ron. Another helpful for you..................at my pleasure.
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Carry on, regardless..................
"In God we trust" to save our country and bring our troops safely home.
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