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1

General Discussion / HWH 725 Jack Issue PC2350

« on: April 19, 2023, 10:10:37 pm »

Hi everyone, so I’m traveling and just encountered an issue with a single Jack (LR) not lowering. The pump runs trying to finish with lowering spring but not happening. I am familiar with replacing parts on this in the past but this issue is not like previous. Reading the online service troubleshooting manual does not have a specific example or I haven’t found it yet.
I was searching this forum and read past subjects related to HWH and surprisingly didn’t see same issue with one Jack not dropping and or extending.
This Jack did have wire broke in past but this issue only caused the Jack to extend immediately due to sensor malfunction. I’ve checked fluid level and the wires look good. This also worked fine 2 nights ago at previous campground. I had to release valve pressure to allow spring to pull Jack back up after multiple attempts pulling down and troubleshooting.  Any suggestions welcome.  I’ll plan to call HMH tomorrow while driving East on 40 and will be sure to share the solution for others once this is figured out.
Thanks!
Rob

2

General Discussion / Re: Sani Con not Working

« on: November 09, 2022, 12:30:22 pm »

Hello, I found this relevent message and wanted to inquire on addtional details.  I have a 2019 2350 and the sanicon sounded slower and slower like not getting enough voltage.  I reviewed the terminals behind the driver wheel and cleaned them up which seemed to work for a short time.  It doesnt work again and removed the wires at the switch, removed the cruddy terminal ends and tested the wire good with 12V. When bypassing the switch and putting both wires together the pump is still not turning on and hear clicking under the bed each time you touch the wires.  Before I pull the bed apart and locate where those wires are going before getting to the sanicon, i was hoping someone else may have furhter details or suggestions.  Thanks everyone!!  Also,  cannot figure out yet how to get to the other wires since unit is all sealed with heat tape, etc? I’d like to check other wires and clean terminals but don’t see them exposed.
Thanks
Rob

3

General Discussion / Re: Electric step

« on: May 10, 2021, 02:56:02 pm »

https://forum.phoenixusarv.com/Smileys/emotes/cheer.gif
Found the issue finally.  I decided to take more black tape off under the step and past the wire harness where I had already replaced butt connectors and found another single wire with butt connector.  It was fully corroded and the wire fell out in my hand once I finished taking black tape off.  After retrimming the wire and installing new connector, the switch worked.  I must say after a month of this issue and now a very sore neck, I am relieved.  Now we just wait for the next thing to fail and require self repair.  https://forum.phoenixusarv.com/Smileys/emotes/2thumbsup.gif

PS, someone tell me why the silly images don't work when you click them or try to add to the message :-)

4

General Discussion / Re: Electric step

« on: May 08, 2021, 10:17:07 am »

Hi Don, thank you for your reply.  Yes I have completed the troubleshooting guides and when testing yellow wire with volt meter at the step / vehicle power harness, there is never any voltage on yellow.  The guide says should have 12v there.  I took the door switch off and reviewed the 2 connectors, took them off and tried bypassing switch and no change. There is also no voltage at that switch at all.. which continues to lead me to that fuse holder under the dash with no power.  Thanks again.

You are using a voltmeter. Multimeter maybe?     So using the continuity test, and making a LONG lead extension you can verify that the fuse under the dash is the source for the yellow door wires that are lacking.

Should that be so, now you know which side of the fuse holder goes to the load. Put one lead into the other side (supply) and you can do a probe around the top contacts on the fuses in the fuse box(es?) and maybe find a poor contact or bad fuse. 

If you a get nowhere with that, then a signal tracer MIGHT help. put the hot into the supply side or the fuse holder under dash, and follow the beeps..

https://www.harborfreight.com/cable-tracker-94181.html   


Useful tool. Even tracks copper pipes in drywall.

This is a 2019 coach? I have an antique (2006) so I expect nothing from the factory. But I would hope that a 2 YO coach has some sort of warranty.     At least there is a hope that the guys that built it are still there and you can ask where that underdash fuse sources power. 

Thanks for the good info, I just ordered the tester and will review once received on Tuesday.

5

General Discussion / Re: Electric step

« on: May 07, 2021, 06:53:19 pm »

Hi Don, thank you for your reply.  Yes I have completed the troubleshooting guides and when testing yellow wire with volt meter at the step / vehicle power harness, there is never any voltage on yellow.  The guide says should have 12v there.  I took the door switch off and reviewed the 2 connectors, took them off and tried bypassing switch and no change. There is also no voltage at that switch at all.. which continues to lead me to that fuse holder under the dash with no power.  Thanks again.

6

General Discussion / Re: Electric step

« on: May 07, 2021, 12:58:29 pm »

I tried bypassing the switch also and no luck.. the only thing I can find is the that 3rd 5amp fuse holder is never getting 12V to send to the switch.  The other 2 fuse holders are showing 12 volt.   It is impossible to trace why that 3rd 5amp fuse holder does not have power.  Very tough to figure this out.  I added a photo.   Also, to recap, the step works, in and out.  it just wont stay open due to the switch at the door know longer working,   weird thing is it would sometimes work again during rain, then stop again.. I checked the grounds I am aware of but now that I found the 3rd fuse holder never having 12V or any power I am thinking that is source problem. Thanks everyone.

7

General Discussion / Re: Electric step

« on: May 06, 2021, 09:55:39 am »

Hi everyone, I have the same problem with the step. I have a 2350 year 2019.  With the voltmeter I have taken the fuses under the dash out and checked each one without the fuse.  One of the 5V plugs related to the step does not show 12V with ignition on or off.  The other 5V plug does show 12V.  So I am trying to find out where trace the power source to this 5V fuse plug.  As this is likely my problem.  Any help appreciated please.
thank you
Rob

8

General Discussion / Re: No AC Power

« on: August 11, 2019, 05:30:27 pm »

Is the big switch by the door on?
Do you have a power management device which has a small meter that reads voltage or error signal?

Did you have 120v power when you ran the generator?
All the breakers are in the Converter box and all should be on.

Main cabin switch is on.. this just happened all of sudden
Yes 120V power works with generator
All breakers that is see are on
There must be another disconnect from where shore power plugs in and goes to breaker panel?
Also noticed charging system not working when vehicle is running.. battery meter would normally show full when engine is running and only shows 2 dots which is status of existing cabin battery.

Traced all power with volt meter and found a short in the 30AMP Black Extension Cord.. wouldn't of thought that be the issue.. wow.  Glad nothing in the cabin was wrong (this time) :-)

9

General Discussion / Re: No AC Power

« on: August 11, 2019, 04:00:28 pm »

Is the big switch by the door on?
Do you have a power management device which has a small meter that reads voltage or error signal?

Did you have 120v power when you ran the generator?
All the breakers are in the Converter box and all should be on.

Main cabin switch is on.. this just happened all of sudden
Yes 120V power works with generator
All breakers that is see are on
There must be another disconnect from where shore power plugs in and goes to breaker panel?
Also noticed charging system not working when vehicle is running.. battery meter would normally show full when engine is running and only shows 2 dots which is status of existing cabin battery.

10

General Discussion / No AC Power - Resolved!

« on: August 11, 2019, 03:39:48 pm »

So, I just noticed no AC power when plugged in this morning.  We have a 2019 E450 2350.  All breakers confirmed on.  I have tried the following troubleshooting so far and decided to share on the forum before I start taking the bed apart to get to the connections.

1. Unplug external AC power.  Turn on Generator.  Confirmed the transfer switch worked and the generator provided power to all equipment.  Confirmed cabin batteries charged some during the generator use.  Turn off generator.
2. Start vehicle, review cabin battery status and no power from vehicle running
3. Reviewed cable connection at battery compartment and all looks tight; but per 1 and 2 that is not where the problem would be.

What am I missing, is there another breaker somewhere that may be tripped preventing AC Power?

Thanks
Rob

11

General Discussion / Re: 2019 E450 2350 Rough Ride

« on: August 04, 2019, 04:26:25 pm »

Rjw, best of luck with the fsd Koni shocks. They didn’t pan out for me. The ride is jarring to say the least. Now there is a chance mine are bad and Koni says if I have my receipt they will replace them.  I’m hoping that’s the case and hoping I can find or obtain a copy of my receipt.


If you haven’t purchased yet I’d suggest calling Koni first. I see on their web site they also list a shock called the EVO 99.  No idea if it might be a better option for the E450 but it might be worth the time to ask.

Thanks I will update again soon. 

12

General Discussion / Re: Water leaks in under passenger side dinnett seat on PC 2100

« on: August 03, 2019, 01:14:23 pm »

Found The Leak !   No more wet carpet under the dinnett seat.  Tested  dry ,dry ...
Now let me tell you where I found the  leak . On the PC 2100 the furnace grille just aft. Of the passenger side dinnett seat , the outside frame not the grille door  that screws 0ff, the outer frame has a seal completely around the frame it was splitting and separated just enough to let water seep in  and run down the wire bundle at the base of the floor under the dinnett table through tunnel step  and find a  spot under the seat carpet that held the wetness.  The Proof: after the carpet was dried  and lifted away using a hair dryer making certain  everything was dry  , using  dry paper towels around the wire bundle and surrounding areas,  everything was dry.  Now went outside the coach and sprayed water around the grille frame. Wamo water seeped in wetting the paper towels running along the wire bundle to the carpet area .Cleaned and dried it again . Then the next day after everything was good and dry , resealed the frame neatly  and completely around using silicone sealer in my case black in color to match exterior  finally letting all dry for another day.  The true test with the paper towels in place,  saturated the PC exterior heavily repeatedly more than any rain can do . Checking cabinets under everything interior and paper towels  dry ,dry 

So glad you found the leak - awesome work troubleshooting! Very happy for you!!!

13

General Discussion / Re: 2019 E450 2350 Rough Ride

« on: August 03, 2019, 01:12:11 pm »

It sounds as if I may be able to achieve a "softer" ride in my 2350/E-450 by running tires below maximum inflation.  Based on my weight ticket (attached) and load table here - https://www.goodyearrvtires.com/pdfs/rv_inflation.pdf -it seems I should easily be able to run fronts at 55-60# and rear dualies at 65#.  I'm wondering if anyone else is/has done this and what the results in ride comfort, handling and/or tire life were for you?

Thanks everyone for your posts and comments.  I went to a CAT Scale yesterday and my 2019 E450 2350 has 3600LB in the front and 8720LB in the rear.  Total 12,320. (full water tank, empty gray and black)
So I guess I need to review the previous chart provided and determine the correct air pressure in front and rear vs going by the place card info? 
Also, it appears because I have to have 90LB in my rear heavy duty air bags to keep them off the inside block (per Bob at Elkhart Hitch).  The rear it not sagging and when you go over a long dip, you can tell the rear air bags are helping, so not convince they are contributing to the overall rough ride especially since most of the rough is experienced in the front.  Hard to say.  I plan to call Elkhart Hitch this morning and share the rear weight and see if he has any other comments related to the bags.

If you own model 2350 of any model year with or without a slide out, and you are putting in the maximum 80 PSI in your tires, that will surely give you a ride of torture to you and your house.  The only benefit to having so much air in the tires will be for improved fuel economy.

RJW365's axle weight numbers seems right to me.  Your front axle is roughly 350 pounds heavier than ours due to the placement of your fresh water tank and also that you have a slide out.  Adjusting your tire pressure to match your actual load will make a really big difference for the better.  Just BE SURE to use a trusted tire gauge.   If it is not a digital tire gauge, I would compare it to one.

90 PSI in those additional rear axle-mounted air bags sounds like a whole lot of extra PSI yielding a much rougher ride.  I recall with our previous motor home, the air bags of a different brand required a minimum of 15 PSI to prevent damage to them.  If you have an E450, I advise to research the minimum requirement for your rear air bags and set them to that minimum during a good long trip, and see what you learn from that PSI setting.  If you own an E350 with lower-rated rear springs and are leveling your rig with air bags, that is a different situation.

About the Phoenix supplied tire label in the door jamb.  For our 2007 PC 2350, the recommendation is real close to my actual load requirement.  I think most of my troubles in past years was related to bad tire gauges providing inaccurate readings by as much as 9 PSI.

It is interesting that the front axle load rating for the E350 and E450 are identical.  They have identical coil springs and all.  The difference in their load rating is all related to the rear axle.  So if you have a short PC with a light weight front axle, your E350 or E450 front suspension is going to make for a rough ride up front.  So MAKE SURE your front tires are not over-inflated.

Ron, thanks for the reply and details! Much appreciated.  The tires installed on the 2019 2350 E450 are Hankook. Tire size is LT225/75R16E.  I will definitely be reviewing the tire pressure ratings and  have always used Acutire digital gauges. The pressure rating on the PC card is 75 front and 80 rear which is what I have inflated but appears this is part of my problem.   The heavy duty version of the air bags on my E450 may also be attributing to the problem. My previous RV 2018 2100 had the standard air bags and keeping 30LB was perfect.  Since we jumped to E450 they wanted to use the heavy bag with a safety block in the bag to prevent tear.  If less than 90LB the damn block is hitting and not helping the rear ride.   I have an active conversation with Elkhart about the pressure ratings in those bags to support the vehicle rear weight.  My 2350 does have a slide out with fridge and couch.  Thanks again and I will update again when I have any new information.

Ah, I understand about your air bags.  You MUST add 90 PSI to prevent internal bottoming-out.  Good that you are working with Phoenix on it.  I understand why you had rear air bags on your previous 2100, an effort to lift the rear to level it along with improved handling.  Why did you add them on your E450 2350?  Did you think...."They helped before so they should help on my new rig?"  I would consider removing them.

About the Phoenix supplied tire pressure sticker.  The recommended 75 PSI in the front and 80 PSI in the rear sounds like a lot more air than your load requires.  Maybe they accidentally placed the wrong sticker.  Ask Phoenix about that.  Maybe they can sent you the right sticker.  Your numbers should be around 60-65 PSI.

Back to air bags.  Our old rig with air bags was proportioned similar to model 2100, a short rig with a large rear over-hang.  CLICK HERE TO SEE IT  The air bags with lots of air stabilized it and lifted it a few inches.  But the ride was rough with a lot of air.  So I adjusted more air or less air as the driving conditions required.  If you look at the picture taken through the driver's door, you can see the air bag control unit with air gauge, located by the driver's left knee.  One button turned on the air pump.  The other button let out air.  Another picture showing the battery compartment & converter, also shows the air compressor.

I recently found out the actual limit of the Air Lift bags is 5000LB and 7500LB for the heavy duty bags.  So this means what I have on the vehicle is already over weighted thus the issues with pressure, etc..  Needless to say we are taking the RV back to Elkhart Hitch at the end of the month to remove the Air Lift system.  They agreed is was a mistake and are refunding.  While I am having the bags taken off, I am going to have the KONI FSD installed.  They have to better than the factory shocks and have researched that is seems I cannot go wrong?  Right?  I will call PC and review the tire weight and sticker they have installed in our 2019 2350. 
Thanks Ron and everyone for all the great comments.  I be sure to share how things go after the bags are removed.  We start a 3 week trip out west the next day so can only pray all goes as expected.

14

General Discussion / Re: 2019 E450 2350 Rough Ride

« on: July 30, 2019, 08:51:10 pm »

Hi Rob hope you get your new PC ride corrected.i know you will find a solution. 
BTW : I'm STEVE I PURCHASED YOUR PC 2100 you traded at the factory in Elkhart. We met there back in May . I want to say thank you  we love our 2100 you took excellent care of it . It's funny I was reading the the forum and I recognized your Doberman  picture and you being in Maryland  named Rob . Again we are super pleased with our 2100 PC  perfect for us . We been traveling quite a bit with it , rides nice with the Air lift ride you installed.

Steve, good to hear from you and hope all is well.  Glad you recognized our Doberman!  That is too funny.  We did enjoy that RV and features but really needed a little more room thus the next level upgrade.  We also had a couple issues but PC was very helpful with repairs.  I hope you continue to enjoy your new PC 2100.  Take care!  Safe Travels.

15

General Discussion / Re: 2019 E450 2350 Rough Ride

« on: July 30, 2019, 08:41:30 pm »

It sounds as if I may be able to achieve a "softer" ride in my 2350/E-450 by running tires below maximum inflation.  Based on my weight ticket (attached) and load table here - https://www.goodyearrvtires.com/pdfs/rv_inflation.pdf -it seems I should easily be able to run fronts at 55-60# and rear dualies at 65#.  I'm wondering if anyone else is/has done this and what the results in ride comfort, handling and/or tire life were for you?

Thanks everyone for your posts and comments.  I went to a CAT Scale yesterday and my 2019 E450 2350 has 3600LB in the front and 8720LB in the rear.  Total 12,320. (full water tank, empty gray and black)
So I guess I need to review the previous chart provided and determine the correct air pressure in front and rear vs going by the place card info? 
Also, it appears because I have to have 90LB in my rear heavy duty air bags to keep them off the inside block (per Bob at Elkhart Hitch).  The rear it not sagging and when you go over a long dip, you can tell the rear air bags are helping, so not convince they are contributing to the overall rough ride especially since most of the rough is experienced in the front.  Hard to say.  I plan to call Elkhart Hitch this morning and share the rear weight and see if he has any other comments related to the bags.

If you own model 2350 of any model year with or without a slide out, and you are putting in the maximum 80 PSI in your tires, that will surely give you a ride of torture to you and your house.  The only benefit to having so much air in the tires will be for improved fuel economy.

RJW365's axle weight numbers seems right to me.  Your front axle is roughly 350 pounds heavier than ours due to the placement of your fresh water tank and also that you have a slide out.  Adjusting your tire pressure to match your actual load will make a really big difference for the better.  Just BE SURE to use a trusted tire gauge.   If it is not a digital tire gauge, I would compare it to one.

90 PSI in those additional rear axle-mounted air bags sounds like a whole lot of extra PSI yielding a much rougher ride.  I recall with our previous motor home, the air bags of a different brand required a minimum of 15 PSI to prevent damage to them.  If you have an E450, I advise to research the minimum requirement for your rear air bags and set them to that minimum during a good long trip, and see what you learn from that PSI setting.  If you own an E350 with lower-rated rear springs and are leveling your rig with air bags, that is a different situation.

About the Phoenix supplied tire label in the door jamb.  For our 2007 PC 2350, the recommendation is real close to my actual load requirement.  I think most of my troubles in past years was related to bad tire gauges providing inaccurate readings by as much as 9 PSI.

It is interesting that the front axle load rating for the E350 and E450 are identical.  They have identical coil springs and all.  The difference in their load rating is all related to the rear axle.  So if you have a short PC with a light weight front axle, your E350 or E450 front suspension is going to make for a rough ride up front.  So MAKE SURE your front tires are not over-inflated.

Ron, thanks for the reply and details! Much appreciated.  The tires installed on the 2019 2350 E450 are Hankook. Tire size is LT225/75R16E.  I will definitely be reviewing the tire pressure ratings and  have always used Acutire digital gauges. The pressure rating on the PC card is 75 front and 80 rear which is what I have inflated but appears this is part of my problem.   The heavy duty version of the air bags on my E450 may also be attributing to the problem. My previous RV 2018 2100 had the standard air bags and keeping 30LB was perfect.  Since we jumped to E450 they wanted to use the heavy bag with a safety block in the bag to prevent tear.  If less than 90LB the damn block is hitting and not helping the rear ride.   I have an active conversation with Elkhart about the pressure ratings in those bags to support the vehicle rear weight.  My 2350 does have a slide out with fridge and couch.  Thanks again and I will update again when I have any new information.