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Topics - Doneworking

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General Discussion / Our Phoenix Cruisers compared to other rigs
« on: February 03, 2016, 08:27:28 pm »
Well, it was a beautiful day in Oklahoma with totally clear skies and a high this afternoon in the high 40s and low 50s.   So, I decided to drive over from Oklahoma City to Tulsa (about 100 miles away and mostly turnpike so a quick and easy trip) and go to the Tulsa Boat and RV Show adn grab lunch at a great Lebanese joint that has been there forever. .  Their shows are always in a building on the fairgrounds  that was built in the 1960s and is over 350,000 square feet of open spanned construction.  When it was built in the Sixties, it was the largest unobstructed spanned building in the world.  No pillars and quite a great building for a show.  That is over eight acres of floor space. 

First of all, who would have thought Okies would buy a yacht in Tulsa for over two million bucks?  Well, they sold it.  It was huge.  Buyers buy these things here and then float them down the Arkansas River (at Tulsa's port) and down to the Mississippi and on into the Gulf.  And we thought our toys were expensive!  They had two of them and they just dominated the bass boats, ski rigs etc.    Bet you didn't know Oklahoma has an outlet to the oceans of the world!.

Lots of RVs including Class A, B and C as well as the "usual prisoners" of huge fifth wheels and pull behinds were present.  I post about this because it is always neat to own something you love (our PC 2350) and go look at new rigs, particularly Class Cs like ours.   I looked at a bunch of them today, talked one couple OUT of buying one ...the salesman was to the side, texting of course....by pointing out some inferior quality and design points on what they were looking at in the rig.   It was their first RV.  I wasn't obnoxious about it, just pointed out the features and told them about Phoenix.  They wrote down the website and went home to take a look. 

Isn't it wonderful to own a tried and true design built by a company that obviously cares?   After owning a PC, lets face it:  many of the "competitive" sized and styled Class Cs are inferior in quality and attention to detail.  Most RV manufacturers are now owned by private equity companies or publicly held companies and they simply do not have the quality because their goal is a fraction of a cent of earnings per share a quarter.   How sad.   

Aren't you glad you own a Phoenix Cruiser?   I am!


General Discussion / Why we all love our Phoenix Cruisers
« on: October 16, 2015, 07:28:10 pm »
I went to the Oklahoma City Fall RV Show yesterday.  This is trailer country, big fifth wheels being the main event at the show.  Still, quite a few Class Cs were there from several manufacturers.  Some of the Cs were so poorly built I suspect a thousand mile trip would require a full set of skills and tools for repair.   I mean CHEAPLY BUILT, obviously thrown together.  I won't name manufacturers, but they included some of the leading brands.  "B+" Cs were in supply and I checked them out carefully.  The floor plans and layout on a few were pretty interesting and attractive.  Virtually all Class Cs are on a Ford or MB chassis, with a few Chevrolets every once in a while.   So I am not commenting on the platforms, just the coaches themselves.  

The problem:  the construction.  I looked behind cabinets, pulled out drawers and inspected reinforcement of floors on the coaches and in the cabinets.  I looked at trim, quality of components and I got down on the floor and looked those babies over carefully.  On one small C I opened an outside door and admired the storage area, carefully closed the door and it fell half off!  I just walked away shaking my head.

I have done all the coach repairs and additions on my motor homes for thirty years and only took one to a dealer one time.  I do not service or repair the chassis stuff myself unless it is pretty minor.  That being said, I have more than a passing knowledge of construction and possible sources of problems on Class C and Class B rigs.  

Compared to our PCs, no other brand I saw passed muster.  There were no Carriage House or Born Free products but they are like Phoenix....mostly available straight from the manufacturer.  

I researched Class Cs for two years on line and in person before we decided on our PC.  Boy, did we make the right decision.  

Thanks, Phoenix Cruiser!!   Thanks for the design and the general quality of your products.  


General Discussion / Macerator pump leak and door strut failure
« on: August 25, 2015, 09:58:32 pm »
Today was the day to work on the macerator.   At the end of a three week trip two weeks ago, the pump started leaking whether running or not when the valves were open.  I closed both gray and black valves after dumping in Amarillo, Texas and drove on home to Oklahoma City (about 260 miles).   I got the rig out of storage today and took a look.   It was leaking at the connection where  the pump  bayonets to the black discharge line.  I removed the pump and checked it out, halfway guessing the housing was cracked.   No cracks.   I took out the flat ring and o ring seals, cleaned them and their seats and re-installed the pump.  Still leaking.

Now, this is a pretty simple setup.  The pump simply twists onto its receiver and leaks are prevented by the two rings.  What could be wrong?  Well, here is what it was:

     The pump is secured with its bayonet fitting and is supported by a U shaped support which is bolted through  the bottom of the storage area for the Sani Com system. Other models may differ from my 2350 in specifics of where the pump is located.   I noticed that the pump was not really in line with the black sewer pipe that fed into it.  When installed, the pump was pulled upward by the U support about a half an inch, putting strain on the mounting at the bayonet.  Over the three years since the rig was made (purchased in September 2012) that stress created by the misalignment had caused a small amount of distortion in the pump and the excess and uneven compression caused the o ring to no longer seal properly.  

The solution was to lower one end of the U support  a half inch by using a longer bolt and spacer to allow the pump to align.   Since the pump is only about 12 inches long, a half inch upward pull on one end is significant.   The installation manual for the pump indicates that the end should be secured in a way to support it with some flexibility.   It is a long way from a little flexibility to being essentially bent upward a half inch and rigidly installed.   No leaks now.  I filled both tanks and dumped them using the pump and all is well.   When something doesn't fit, forcing it to do so can result in a heck of a mess and problem sometime later for the owner.  

Also today, I fixed one of the struts that hold up the back storage area access door (where we store our hoses and the power cords on all PCs).  It had come loose from the door and all three screws had popped out.  No wonder.  When it was installed the bracket at the base of the strut was installed to a support that apparently had missed a screw or rivet and was flexing.   Who ever had installed it at the factory must have known of the problem because there were two sets of three holes, the sets being about 3/4 inch apart.  At first if it doesn't work, just move it over!   Glad Boeing doesn't do that building planes :beg

I reinforced the strut bracket mounting so it would not flex, re-installed the strut in the proper location.   I replaced the screws on both struts where they mount to the door with screws both slightly longer and with a larger diameter to decrease pressure on the mounting.   One size screw just doesn't cut it everywhere a screw is used :'(

I report both of these repairs to my fellow owners so that if you have these problems you can  profit from my experience.  If the macerator leaks, check the alignment.   You might also check your two struts to make sure they are properly secured.  

Phoenix Cruisers clearly enjoy a built quality much higher than most Class C motor homes.   But regardless of that, just a simple error or "hurry up" on the production line can cause a real pain in the fanny for the owner sometime in the future.   A couple of minutes saved is a couple of hours spent by the purchaser repairing a problem that should never had occurred.  



General Discussion / DC power Use and Store switch
« on: July 10, 2015, 05:17:22 pm »
Our 2350 has a Intellitec BDO power switch to turn the 12 volt DC circuits on and off.  It is located just above the inside step coming into the unit.  I think all PCs are laid out about the same.  On two  occasions lately, I have had the solenoid fail to engage properly thus when I push the "use" denying the coach DC power.  Thus far, I have been able to turn it off and on a couple of times and get it to catch.  On line research indicates this is a simple power solenoid with an electrically operated latching switch to turn on the DC.  That is assuming this non engineer is guessing and interpreting with a bit of luck.  :help

The online graphics show two wires coming in from the switch by the door and then a large heavy duty terminal on either side for the  DC source from the batteries in and out, thus just four connections.  The switch and light at the door appear to be a simple pilot light display and a DPDT or some similar switch to send DC to activate the solenoid and deactivate it by reversing polarity.

Here are my questions:  

1.  Has anyone else had any problems with this use/store switching device?  

2.  Have you replaced the solenoid?  

3.  I think it is located under the bed and it will take the help of my wife to turn it off and on before I can tell for sure.  Does anyone know where it is on a 2350?

We are leaving on a  boondocking trip in a few days and are going to be totally off the grid and DC dependent.

4.  Anyone have a thought if  - in an emergency - the switch and solenoid could be bypassed and the two power wires coming into and out off the solenoid just temporary spliced together to provide full time DC until our trip is over?   I don't have time to order the switch and install it or have it checked out by someone before we leave on our trip. AND it is now engaged and all is well......I just don't want that puppy to disengage and leave us without power a long way from anywhere and that is where we will be for a while.

I know nothing about this circuit because this is the first time I have ever experienced this problem in any of our rigs over the years.  It just seems logical but logic and  electrical can get a guy in trouble, so I ask for your input.


General Discussion / Bathroom heater vent in 2350
« on: May 16, 2015, 09:09:36 pm »
The heater outlet (register) in our 2350 is small and is located immediately behind the commode.  It does a poor job of distributing any air in the bathroom area.  Has anyone modified/moved this outlet?  I pulled the mattress and the strand board that supports the mattress and took a look at the pump, a crimped line from the fresh water tank, and this outlet layout.   Fixed the crimp and decided the pump was for another day of adding a small pressure tank to reduce cycling.   To move the heater outlet there are at least three problems: 

                        1.  You just about have to pull the stool.  Not that hard but not that pleasant a task
                        2.  There is very limited space to move the outlet to the right or left sides of the stool, moving it towards the bathroom door as far as possible would be the most effective.
                        3.  Repairing the hole from the previous installation, which would probably just consist of cutting a little square face plate to cover it up.  No big deal....

Anyone done anything like this on their 2350?  On cold mornings, there is just not sufficient and properly distributed air to be effective.   I can't imagine why it was located where it is and what the reasoning was in doing so.


General Discussion / 2350 Tire Pressure
« on: April 16, 2015, 07:29:07 am »
OK, I searched the forum and read some information about tire pressures.  

Here is my question:  on a Phoenix Cruiser 2350 Ford 350 with slide and fully loaded (water, gear etc) what tire pressure are you using?  

The sticker shows 75 front, 65 rear.   Now, I know to be technical each axle should be CAT weighed and to be really technical each of the surface contacts should be weighed separately.   I just need to know this:  what pressure do folks with this specific unit use?  65 rear seems low to me and 75 front seems high, both by five pounds or so. 

This question is really specific to Ford 350s.  I have owned 450s in the past but this is my first 350.  The tires are new MS2 thanks to the recall.


General Discussion / How many Phoenix Cruisers are on the road?
« on: November 21, 2014, 08:50:26 am »
We have now owned the 2350 for a little over a year and have made several trips in it, two were over 1500 miles round trip.  Occasionally, someone on this forum will report spoting another PC.  Since we seldom see other PCs, I ask this question:  does anyone have any idea how many PCs are out there?  Has PC ever released to the public their production unit numbers?   It is so seldom we spot a fellow traveler in a Phoenix Cruiser, I just wonder about these numbers.


General Discussion / 2350 Corner Bed sheets
« on: September 01, 2014, 09:01:31 am »
We found these sheets on Amazon and ordered a set to try to help solve the perpetual corner bed problems.   The sheets were made by a small company in South Carolina and we found them to be very well made indeed.   The fact that the set was specifically designed for a Winnie View made us wonder how it would work for our PC 2350.  The View has a curved slice corner whereas the PC corner is straight and slanted.  The good news is they worked very well for us and better than any other thing or method we have tried.   My wife was surprised at how well they worked and the high quality.   The slight difference in dimensions from the View to the PC didn't present a problem, at least for us.  The construction of the bottom of the top sheet is that it has elastic sewn around to keep the sheet in place and prevent slipping.  Read the full description on Amazon for more complete info.



General Discussion / Ford 350/450 shifting advice
« on: July 16, 2014, 06:36:54 pm »
I am curious about others experience with the Ford vehicles when in mountains.   Our 2350 is pulling a Jeep Cherokee which weighs about 4044 curb pounds.   I am surprised how the V10 seems to really pull down on mountain passes, granted they are Rocky Mountain passes where I have experienced this and I am towing.  After one trip in June (and planning another in August) we will probably just unhook the Jeep and my wife will drive it up the passes.  We will be boondocking above 10,000 feet so I am not talking hills :lol

Here is my question.   Do most PC owners use the tow/haul mode which, as I understand it, just changes the shifting points, or do they not use it and just use the downshift from the standard drive position, as well as engine speed to maintain momentum.  Our last Class C  was a 450 and this is a 350 and we were not towing.  I was down to 25 mph going up Bobcat Pass in Northern New Mexico last month.   Maybe that is just the way it is?  Our most previous RV was a Roadtrek Class B 210 with the Chevy 6.0L

ALSO...I have read in some places that the V10 is designed to develop max torgue at 4500-5000 rpms.  Is that correct?   I read on another forum a discussion that indicated that was no problem, but I always hate to "cram" an engine. 

Any experiences, direction or suggestions you could give me would be appreciated. 


General Discussion / Solar installation
« on: May 04, 2014, 11:35:19 am »
I am thinking about adding a small solar system to our 2350.  I am looking at the Renogy 100 Watt Monocrystalline Solar Panel kit from Amazon, complete with controller.  I am familiar with the math and charging rates of these kinds of installations and I know that 100 watts is pretty minimum.  All we really want from the system is a slow trickle charge for our battery bank when we are boondocking for several days.  Having come from a B Roadtrek, we would take day trips in the RT which recharged our batteries.   There is nothing less desireable than the sound of a genset in a national forest IMO.  BTW, I have changed all the incandescent bulbs in the PC to LEDs which is a big deal for us as to how we use power when we camp.   Where we go, there is no over the air tv and we seldom use any of the entertainment stuff other than the radio (remember those primitive devices?) for a little news.  No cell service where we go most of the time in the summer (way back in the NM and CO mountains). 

I searched these PC forums for solar and got some great ideas on the installation.  My only hesitation is drilling into that pristine roof.   It was noted (and a schematic was shown for a different model) that the PC construction has metal cross members every two feet across the roof for strutural integrity.  Obviously, you would need to mount (or a least partially mount) to those.  One post I researched indicated that those supports are also used for a wiring chase for some lights.  Sounds nasty to drill into if you hit a wire.  Is that in fact the case?  I understand the roof to be a thin fiberglass or similar material over plywood but I have no idea of the plywood thickness.  Anyone know how thick? 

Also, anyone that has done their own installation more recently than those posts (some of which are a couple of years old), do you have any tips or thoughts to suggest?  I plan to over engineer the mounting by using the standard Z mounts to attach to flat aluminum stock a couple of inches wide, mount the stock into the roof and then also use a good RV sealant/glue the length of the aluminum stock (1/8 inch thick by 2 inches by 48 inches) to further assure integrity of mount.  I have done a lot of mods on Bs and Cs over the years, so I can figure out the wire runs, etc.  Just properly attaching that puppy is my biggest concern.  I suspect finding the metal cross pieces in the PC frame will be pretty easy with stud finders or magnets. 

Any ideas, thoughts, suggestions or personal experiences would be appreciated.   Perhaps I also need to call PC and double check with them about the wire chases. 

I just got a braking and towing system for our new Cherokee Trailhawk and so I don't want to spend much for a small solar assist to charging.  I figure if I like the 100 watt system, I will add another panel before fall.


General Discussion / Thermostat?
« on: March 29, 2014, 09:12:50 am »
A new problem came up yesterday in our 2013 2350.   When I turn on the furnace at the thermostat, the AC also comes on.  Or, it may be the heat strips.  If I unplug from shore power, the furnace works fine from the thermostat.  

Two Questions:  
                         1.  Does this sound like a bad thermostat?  I pulled  the cover and checked the three wires for loose connections, no problem.  
                         2.  What kind of temperature should be coming from the heat strips?  Mine is barely warm.  I assume it is just a 1500 watt strip and should be putting out air equivalent to a small space heater.  Is that correct?  I am wondering if the AC is running at the same time as the strips, another sign of a control problem?  

Unfortuantely, I messed up my knee earlier in the week and can't make it to the top to check it out until the knee gets checked out.  

The model number on the back of the thermostat does not show up on a search of the Dometic website or a google search.  I wonder if it is discontinued or something.   I guess I will call PC Monday and see if they are still using that same thermostat.   Of course, I am just assuming it is the thermostat.  Unfortunately, the warranty is for two years for the original purchaser only and the unit is less than 18 months inservice, but I bought it from the original owner and therefore am the second owner.  

Anyone else had this problem on the unit?  


General Discussion / Roof top carrier
« on: March 08, 2014, 09:50:31 am »
Hopefully, next week is the end of our winter here in Oklahoma City. Today: snow!  Monday:  74 degrees.  Welcome to "normal" on the Southern Plains. 

We certainly look forward to many adventures in our PC2350, but we are dealing with the limited exterior storage available compared to our previous RV (Roadtrek 210 Class B).  Two alternatives come to mind, the easiest being a hitch carrier.   We have used them before, but the design of the PC would cause the license plate to be covered.  The solution is either a drop hitch receiver to pick up a few inches or something like a StowAway that allows the plate to be secured on it and lighted as well.   Since we will be just toting camper junk, I really prefer a cheap carrier and have used them in the past.

Second, that roof has some nice room up at the top of the ladder.  My old Sears roof carrier I used on a Jeep GC many years ago is hanging from the ceiling in the garage and the colors even match the PC.   Wouldn't take much modification to make that work. 

My question:  has anyone installed a roof storage container and if so, how did you secure it?   Drilling into the roof gives me pause and simply strapping down to the ladder rail bars on the roof would probably be really  inadequate.  I have no idea what might lurk in the roof (wiring? etc.) and I am not sure of its structural makeup for securing something like a storage box. 

In any event, of course, only really light weight stuff would be put up there.  When you are dry camping you just need (or at least we do) more "stuff" than fits into that one exterior storage area on the 2350.


General Discussion / First trip on our 2350: a report
« on: November 11, 2013, 11:12:43 am »
We bought a 2013 PC2350 from a guy less than three miles from our house two months ago.  Unfortunately, circumstances delayed our using the new unit until last week.  During the intervening time, I checked out all the systems thoroughly.   Just thought I might share with the forum a few observations.

Our previous RV was a 2007 Roadtrek 210P dollied out with all the options and goodies.   We loved and still do love our RT.   We just decided to try something a little bigger and see how we did with it, now that I am retired and have more time to spend traveling.  We have owned small Class Cs in the past, the most recent experience being a Gulfstream BT Cruiser until we bought our RT in 2006.

This trip was a total of a little less than six hundred miles from Oklahoma City over to Magazine Mountain State Park in Arkansas, the highest point in the state and a state park we have enjoyed for years.  If you ever go, get reservations!  Only 18 sites for camping and a view from the top of 50 or 60 miles in every direction.  The foliage, by the way, was at its peak and about the best year for leaves we have seen in AR in a very long time. 

We were surprised at how well the PC drove and handled.  I had read several posts on this forum about wondering and stability problems, but experienced none of that.    About 450 miles of this shakedown cruise was on Interstate 40 and the crosswinds were 20+ most of the time, broadside, and of course truck traffic is relentless on that road.   The remaining trip was twisty/turney Arkie roads, all very well maintained but typical hilly/mountain head spinners to us flatlanders.   The PC handled much better than anticipated.   I did find the steeper grades to be a bit of a challenge, but that is what downshifting an automatic with your foot is all about.  We spend a month or so in the Rockies in the summer so that will be interesting to see how grades are handled at 10-12,000 feet.   Gas mileage?  I didn't calculate because of an error in filling the tank prior to departure, but I would guess around 9+ and I was driving about 65mph on the Interstate.   That is about 40% less than we would achieve in our Roadtrek. 

Laying in the corner bed the first night, my wife declared it was a quarter mile to the dash!  After seven years in a RT, it did seem like a far piece up there!  We arrived in a dense fog and experienced that same weather the next day.  That made the additional space in the PC a real luxury to us former B people.  A bad weather day or two can get quite dicey in a B.

We found the luxury of a dry bath simply that:  a luxury.   We did confirm what we thought we knew all along and that is that the inside storage in the 2350 is, believe it or not, less than the storage in the RT 210 and not quite as useful for our needs.  The RT was equipped with the armoire option.   The outside storage for camping was not quite as good, IMO, as the RT.  We knew that going into the purchase so no surprise, just confirmation.   My wife claims that the interior storage is about the same, just much differntly arranged.  RT is the only manufacturer I know that states the cubic volume of the storage for each model on their specs.   The solution is simple:  I am going to convert one of the two wardrobes in the 2350 to shelves.   We prefer to store our clothing folded and flat, finding that more manageable than a crowded small closet.   We did the same thing in our RT when we got it and it made a world of sense to us and worked out very well.  Some folks would not find this to be true, I am sure, so it is just a matter of personal preference.   Adjustable shelves in most of the cabinets would make a lot of difference in useability for us. 

As to fit and finish, the RT wins the race.   Class Cs are just not finished to the degree of Class Bs from what I have seen over the years.   The PC is nicely finished, just less so than the RT in my personal opinion.  HOWEVER, it is much better built and finished than most Cs we have seen.  Now, I have been a wood worker all my life so my standards are a little higher and more peculiar than most.   By the way, looking at new RTs at RV shows, I don't think their fit and finish is nearly as good as our 2007 model.  Roadtrek is  building more and more units and that is the inevitable price of volume.

What we have is, as expected, a trade off:  more personal space and room in the PC than the RT.  The cost of that is less convenience of parking and driving and higher operational costs.   Since we plan on boondocking virtually all the time, I can see a toad in our future (probably a good used Wrangler). 

Yesterday was a beautiful 65 degree fall day.  Tuesday night it will be down to 23 so Sunday was the time to first winterize.   Our Roadtrek had lived in a HVAC controlled garage at our house for seven years and we never had to winterize.  Having owned Cs in the past, I could recall the drill.   I prefer to use my air compressor to fully evacuate the lines and then use the "pink stuff".  Boy did I do overkill this first time!   I don't want to take any chances.   

In summary, we really love our new 2350 and look forward to many happy years of use.  I have compared it in this post to our old Roadtrek as a reference because I know a lot of B owners that yearn for more and C owners that yearn to just pop into a parking place anywhere.  A B or small C is just a matter of personal preference and each has its virtues and limitations.

 I would constructively suggest to PC that they update and expand their manual.  RV manuals are usually pretty generic, but the PC manual really needs an upgrade.  I feel sorry for any purchaser that has no previous RV experience.   He or she better have a good friend in the neighborhood that is an RVer!  Again, the Roadtrek experience spoiled me because the manual is very specific and expanded, including electrical schematics and blownup schematics of plumbing showing every connection.   Of course, in a B getting to anything to work on requires a contortionist and a two foot tall one at that.   Working on the PC will be a breeze after those experiences. 

General Discussion / Questions from a Newbie
« on: September 19, 2013, 04:26:01 pm »
We bought our 2013 2350 a couple of weeks ago from a guy locally that owned it only for a few months.   I have been going over it with a fine comb trying to understand all the systems.  The seller furnished me the "manual" which is very abbreviated and generic.   This is not our first motorhome so I can figure out most of the stuff myself with a little investigation and reading.  

A couple of things I need help with:
We bought our 2013, 2350 a couple of weeks ago from a guy locally that owned it only for a few months and wanted a Class A.   I have been going over it with a fine comb trying to understand all the systems.  The seller furnished me the "manual" which is very abbreviated and generic.   This is not our first motorhome so I can figure out most of the stuff myself with a little investigation and reading.  I also got all the stuff for the appliances and systems. 

A few things I need help with:

1.  There is a rocker switch that has been installed by PC on the lower dash immediately to the left of the steering column.   It seems to activate something under the hood.  Is this a temporary transfer switch to start the vehicle with the coach battery in case of failure of the chassis battery?   That is the only thing I could think of.  What is this switch?

2.  In the rear exterior storage area there are three pvc valves mounted to the right side of the cabinet which I assume are the low point drains.  Is that correct?   Is there any "trick" or "secrets" to winterizing that are unique to PCs?

3.  Is there a bypass for the water heater and if so, where is it located? 

4.  The inverter is 1800 watts and I suspected that it ran more than just the tvs and entertainment systems, but I was apparently incorrect.   My refrig is two way and I am use to a three way, using DC only to run down the road.  I was hoping the inverter would operate the refrig 110v AC heating element (normally only a 200-400 watt element) but I guess it does not.   I used a voltmeter and determined which AC outlets are wired to the inverter.   I was also hoping the inverter could be used for the microwave but apparently not wired there either, which makes sense because someone would surely try to run the convection side also and that would blow the overload.

5.  In regard to the refrig, I assume with these two ways (I have not had anything but a three way) you just run down the road on gas like the trailer folks do.  Or, just keep the doors shut for a short trip and keep the thing shut off.   That is not an option with my wife!   

If anyone could please respond to my questions, I would be very appreciative..............and I hope I have posted this in the correct spot, since I am new to this forum.


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