General Discussion / Re: PC on the cover of FMCA magazine again« on: March 31, 2012, 11:32:38 pm »
Ok, forget the 2350, I want the 2910T! <j/k> ;-)
Very nice write-up. Well deserved!
Very nice write-up. Well deserved!
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The 3.0L and all other commonn rail diesels are not suppose to ilde but I do not know exaclty why that is. Driving around the block or being able to "up idle" by using the cruise control setting as was the case on other diesels that I have owned is just not a feature on the 3.0L. Perhaps Sprinter owners can share what the verbage says in their new Sprinter books. In my 3.0L jeep book it is bold to not idle period.
Go to Google and search for something like "does idling your car engine for long periods harm the engine"? You'll find, as usual, a fair amount of discussion, but I think you'll find the majority view is that it can hurt the engine, the catalytic converter, and the environment. My memory of the military is that the one exception are the big multifuel trucks which are better off if left idling rather than being shut down for short periods of time. The most reliable of these answers probably come from people like Click and Clack on NPR or other practicing mechanics. Check it out and see what you think.
The 3.0L can NOT be idled at all. Doing so other than for a couple minutes to cool the turbo down will do long term damage to the engine. The V -10 CAN IDLE ALL DAY. THANKS
Unless special ordered, the 2350 and 2400 models are built on E350 and Sprinter chassis. Consequently, the E450 chassis is irrelevant for this example.
The PC models built on the Ford E350 chassis are 9'10" high.
The PC models built on the Sprinter chassis are 10'1" high.
Simply judging from photos on the PC site, the rear extreme wheel width of the Sprinter is 10 to 12" narrower than the Ford.
A taller object on a narrower base results in a higher center of gravity and reduced resistance to sway and/or rollover (draw the triangles).
Granted, these are extremes and electronic stability control can help. But it cannot change the physics involved.
I don't have a PC yet, but ..... ran across a Alberta couple who did and they do NOT have a gen. What they do have is 340 WATTS of SOLAR that meets their purpose when DRY camping, as we were doing. The solar does a good job of keeping the house batteries up, even with watching DVD's in the evening they said. He meantioned that IF the solar doesn't do it, they can just start the Sprinter engine and charge the batteries if necessary...
I thought I posted my response but don't see it here.
Yes it is "gasoline" in the PC. As ragoodsp posted that sucker in the HR was heavy, installed weight IIRC was ~ 1200lbs genset/radiator/water/etc. Diesel fuel price in our ownership was consistently 30-40% higher $'s, upside is that there is more energy in a gallon of diesel vs gasoline, BUT NOT 30-40% MORE ENERGY. Another upside to the HR the genset would run everything at once in the MH. Another downside to a 2 fuel vehicle is the increased support weight of both tanks, I think because of the seperation layer in diesel that those tanks are still metal. But with a diesel in a PC you would still have 2 systems and you are adding a third fuel system. As far as exhaust goes the diesel runs cooler so attendant parts can be smaller, and were, compared to the gasoline genset in the PC. LImited use, including storage will present a water/fuel separation layer in a diesel system and is something that is mandatory to take care, including frequent filter changes on the genset and addition of chemicals that "supposedly" treat the condition. That happened as part of the larger picture on the HR but would have to be addressed separately on a
PC. Twas me, I would investigate a much larger or even two equal sized propane tanks. In my mind at least the overall weight gain would be small[er (much??)] compared to adding a diesel genset and fuel tank.
I think that everyone comes up with different answers about generators. If you're diesel powered, you have the choice of a costly, noisy, diesel or an LP model that's sucking up your very limited supply of furnace, water heater, sometimes refrigerator, and cooktop fuel. What you really have to look at is what are you going to use the generator for. We tend to put very little hours on our generator, primarily using it to run the microwave and A/C when we stop to eat lunch at a roadside park or rest stop. We hate RV parks that are what I call parking lots with hookups, but we do look for state parks and other wooded facilities with a minimum of water and electricity and preferably sewer hookups. Consequently, if I had a diesel unit, I could probably use an LP generator with no problems at all. How much are you going to use your generator??
As an unbiased engineer, I don't credit stability control as having a complete ability to compensate for the difference in the rear track/wheel width to height ratio between the Sprinter and the Ford. Electronics cannot completely compensate for the physics regarding the moment of lever difference (the center of gravity is considerably lower on the Ford than the Sprinter and that is what, pound for pound, counteracts inertia/swaying once initiated).
I've driven both and the Sprinter is not as stable as the Ford on secondary roads. Try a fast lane change on both and you can easily experience the difference.
This is not an opinion but a statement founded on facts.
Some people say they'd never have a diesel genset, no matter what.
Any comments or opinions?
I had a 7.5 ONAN in the front of a 34' HR Ambassador, water cooled 3 cylinder. No problems, not noisy at all, could not hear it in the rear of the coach. It's another engine to maintain and fairly expensive. Smell was no worse than the pusher diesel. Never had a trouble code on it, can't say the same for the Cummins that was "outback". Parts (filters) came from Cummins (do they own ONAN??) and they discount nothing for anyone near as I could tell.
Come to think about it the generator was "the" bright spot on that MH. I'll stick with PC and the gas generator on mine.
I think I see now where the contradictory information on the ability to use hydraulic levellers on the Sprinter based motorhomes came from. The great majority of the earlier Sprinters were simply the standard long wheebase unibody vans equipped as motorhomes. The newer Class B and C motorhomes are now on a cab chassis unit resembling the Ford cutaway that has a real frame on it. The concern as I read it on some postings was that the old unibody did not take well to being torqued by lifting with a leveller and did not have good places to attach the leveller. I think that all went away with the more conventional frame.