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General Discussion / RV (as an industry) Quality Re: Introduce Yourself!

« on: July 04, 2012, 11:02:50 pm »

Ron,
Knowing that an RV is going to Rock 'N Roll down the road it would be nice if the engineers would spend a little more time and money on design and construction rather than giving it over to the marketers who only seem to care about the flash and the bling.  I know, I know, flash and bling sell.

If the cabinetry is subject to the stress of vibration and torque why not design it to be able to tolerate those forces.  I would think boat builders have had to deal with the same problems, and the consequences of failure in a boat can be much more deadly.  Maybe construction with some kind of dampening or isolation from the frame, with some built in flexion to allow for motion.  I don't know, I'm not an engineer, not even a decent carpenter, but the problem doesn't seem insurmountable.  I would happily live with one-piece molded fiberglass cabinetry if that would solve the problem.  Might not be the prettiest.  I think the manufacturers are still stuck in the "grandma" mindset, where the RV has to look like my grandmother's living room or it won't sell.  That is slowly changing.  Anything more modern is now called "Euro", but it doesn't mean the quality has improved, just the skin.  The possibilities for some radical thinking are evident in some of the one-off designs you can see, but hardly any of them ever make it to a real product.  I think there is far too much timidity in the industry and I can hardly blame them, coming off a recession that killed off a great many of them. But the generation coming up behind me, you might call them the iPod generation, expect innovation and quality.  If you want to sell them an RV you'd better not show them shoddy workmanship and insipid design and expect them to buy it.

End of rant, signing off now.

Dave

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General Discussion / RV (as an industry) Quality Re: Introduce Yourself!

« on: July 04, 2012, 03:37:33 pm »

Ron,
Thanks for the info.  I like your cardboard box analogy.  I'd never thought of it that way, but it makes sense.  My wife and I had commented to a salesman on the overall lack of quality we were seeing in a particular manufacturers RV we were looking at.  He made a comment to the effect that these were homes on wheels, subject to a lot of motion and we could expect some problems.  Peg and I just looked at each other in disbelief.  This was a brand new motor home we were in, and a cabinet door had already fallen off it's hinges.  We were assured that they would "make it right" if we bought the unit.  Right.

I've pretty much decided on the Ford chassis, as much as I love the MB.  Expense, carrying capacity, extra cost, maintenance cost, service availability all factor into the decision.  We probably won't order until after the New Year, we need to get a few more ducks in a row first.  I'll continue to follow your posts, as well as those from the others here.  There is a lot of good information in this forum and people seem genuinely satisfied with their PCs. 

And since this is the Fourth of July, I'll wish everyone a safe and happy holiday.

Dave

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General Discussion / RV (as an industry) Quality Re: Introduce Yourself!

« on: July 01, 2012, 11:31:39 pm »

Thanks Kevin,

I didn't inspect the PC as thoroughly as you did.  I have watched the construction videos of both the CH and the PC and was impressed with both.  However, they only show you what they want you to see.  I'm glad you thought the PC was the equal of, if not better than the CH.

Yes, diesel is more than gas, but it's 30-40% more efficient, so I read.  The price gap seems to be narrowing.  Psychologically I think it's easier to fill a tank with diesel, knowing that you are getting better mileage and that the engine will last a lot longer.  Whether it makes financial sense is another question.  And how often do we make decisions with our hearts rather than our heads?

You had a good idea about towing, which we had talked about but forgotten:  Take some trial runs with and without a toad, and see what feels right.

Dave

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General Discussion / Re: Introduce Yourself!

« on: July 01, 2012, 02:23:13 pm »

Hello Everyone,
My name is Dave, my wife is Peg and we just came  back from Albuquerque to look at a 2551.  We're interested in a 2350 but decided to look at the 2551 to evaluate the quality of build.  I'm happy to say we were pleased with what we saw.  We've gone back and forth, looking at many As, Bs, and Cs.  We've gone from thinking 24 feet to 35 feet back to 24.  The floor plan of the 2350 ticks all of our boxes, but we have questions which I hope other PC owners can answer.

The main question is gas or diesel?  I know there are many variables, and that it depends partly on how many miles we plan on driving.  What I'd like to get a handle on is the TCO (total cost of ownership).  The MB is $12k more upfront, but what is the depreciation like compared to the Ford?  I've heard that the MB is very expensive to have worked on, does anyone have any figures on routine maintenance?  I've also heard it can be difficult to get the MB worked on, whereas there is a Ford dealer on almost every corner. 

Fuel mileage is better with the diesel, but whether it is better enough given all the above is what I'm trying to work out.  I'm told the Ford get ~10 mpg while the diesel can get ~18 mpg and up.  I love the MB cab and the one I have driven (Leisure Travel Serenity) handled well.  The Ford has a beefier chassis, however, and a greater GVWR.  We do plan to get a version with a slide, which decreases our carrying capacity on the MB, less so on the Ford.  What are owners' experiences with the MB?  Do you find yourself limited by the GVWR, especially if you have a slide?  How does the higher profile MB handle high winds and truck wakes?

How many 2350 owners tow a vehicle?  Do you find you need one, or is the unit small enough that you don't need a second vehicle. 
We go back and forth on that, too.  We're planning on using this for extended vacations of 3 - 4 weeks.  Part of the time is just sitting by the beach or a lake, the rest of the time will be for exploring; museums, art galleries, farmers' markets, etc.  I think a towed car, something like a Honda Fit, gives us that much more flexibility.  Thoughts?

Finally, any thoughts on quality, durability and reliability.  Our Gold Standard, from what we've seen, is something like Coach House or Leisure Travel.  Coach House is too expensive for us and Leisure Travel, our first choice, does not have the floor plan we want.  As I said, PC ticks all our boxes.

Finally, if you've read this far, thanks.  On an unrelated subject, is there any way to turn off the annoying dancing emoticons at the top of the page?