Cruisers Forum
Main Forum => General Discussion => Topic started by: longdog2 on August 30, 2019, 09:13:09 pm
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I got my 2017 Phoenix Cruiser 2552 in March of this year. I have run the generator each month since then without a problem. Two weeks ago before I left on a trip, my DH checked the battery and added a little distilled water as well as cleaning all the battery posts, checking tires, etc. When I left the next morning, I was going to run the generator under a load for the monthly exercise. It wouldn't start. The same thing happened when I was on the way home. It did not turn over or start and the light on the switch did not come on nor did any codes show up. Two days ago, I drove out to storage to try it again. Although I had turned the house batteries off when I took the RV the to storage, the house batteries were dead.
Any idea of what could be wrong? I wondered if DH might have hooked batteries up wrong so would appreciate a picture of how they should be hooked up. Could that have affected the generator?
I hate to take it into the shop if it is some minor thing that I could correct. DH rarely does anything on my RV so if I complain, it may be the last time he helps out.
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If you could post a picture of what you have today regarding your battery-hookup, that would help a lot.
The wiring is different if you have two 6V batteries or two 12V batteries. That might be the source of possible confusion. Another potential error your hubby could have made is that PCs often have pairs of red and black battery cables. The same-color cables need to share the battery terminal, red to "+" and black to "-".
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This is how the batteries should look:
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Thanks so much. I will drive out to my storage place today and compare.
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Before you change anything, are you using 2 6v batteries in series or 2 - 12v batteries in parallel?
Have you actually checked battery voltage before storage with a digital voltmeter?
There are a few things that still draw power with main switch off but not enough to make them go dead that quickly.
If there are not any bad components do you know if you start your RV that it will charge the batteries faster than the generator? Monitor the battery voltage. It should jump up to about 13.2 volts as soon as you start the engine.
If you are using the generator and not 120v power plug to charge it takes hours to charge the batteries.
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https://photos.google.com/share/AF1QipOI0xWPusLugx3cLSt9juxa57r6YfD2oKiXXgB0H16TQRxYE4pnNE441poTX52TqA/photo/AF1QipNJdTtma-ltyWasLu2tXMcR2S9d8HsyM3_5Mo7d?key=ZzExcmJ5bHQ5V2RZaVNmUDcwMFJyem16QXllX3l3 (https://photos.google.com/share/AF1QipOI0xWPusLugx3cLSt9juxa57r6YfD2oKiXXgB0H16TQRxYE4pnNE441poTX52TqA/photo/AF1QipNJdTtma-ltyWasLu2tXMcR2S9d8HsyM3_5Mo7d?key=ZzExcmJ5bHQ5V2RZaVNmUDcwMFJyem16QXllX3l3)
This is a photo of my current battery set-up. To me, it looks just like the picture from donc13.
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Those batteries are in series, so 6V batteries.
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https://photos.google.com/share/AF1QipOI0xWPusLugx3cLSt9juxa57r6YfD2oKiXXgB0H16TQRxYE4pnNE441poTX52TqA/photo/AF1QipNJdTtma-ltyWasLu2tXMcR2S9d8HsyM3_5Mo7d?key=ZzExcmJ5bHQ5V2RZaVNmUDcwMFJyem16QXllX3l3 (https://photos.google.com/share/AF1QipOI0xWPusLugx3cLSt9juxa57r6YfD2oKiXXgB0H16TQRxYE4pnNE441poTX52TqA/photo/AF1QipNJdTtma-ltyWasLu2tXMcR2S9d8HsyM3_5Mo7d?key=ZzExcmJ5bHQ5V2RZaVNmUDcwMFJyem16QXllX3l3)
This is a photo of my current battery set-up. To me, it looks just like the picture from donc13.
That is correct, they are 2 6v batteries properly wired in your photo.
I don't know what the extra red and black wires that are cable tied to the heavy battery wires are.
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You have two 6V GC2 batteries wired in series. The Battery connections look perfect to me. Rule out that as a possible culprit.
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So I guess that means that the batteries could have just failed? I have a solar panel so do you think maybe the extra wires could be for it? The RV is stored under a roof.
As far as charging it as suggested above, the generator wouldn't start which is where this all started so I definitely won't be using it for charging. I guess I will need to bring it back to the house and put the batteries on a charger.
I may need two new batteries. If these either hold a charge or end up being replaced, could the battery problem be why the generator wouldn't start? The light on the switch didn't come on, there were no codes showing, and it didn't turn over. My DH had me start the engine and try the generator. He said he heard it turn over once but didn't start and nothing lit up or showed codes.
One other question, are these the right kind of batteries for my set up?
Thanks for the help.
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So I guess that means that the batteries could have just failed? I have a solar panel so do you think maybe the extra wires could be for it? The RV is stored under a roof.
As far as charging it as suggested above, the generator wouldn't start which is where this all started so I definitely won't be using it for charging. I guess I will need to bring it back to the house and put the batteries on a charger.
I may need two new batteries. If these either hold a charge or end up being replaced, could the battery problem be why the generator wouldn't start? The light on the switch didn't come on, there were no codes showing, and it didn't turn over. My DH had me start the engine and try the generator. He said he heard it turn over once but didn't start and nothing lit up or showed codes.
One other question, are these the right kind of batteries for my set up?
Thanks for the help.
Start the engine, wait about 10 minutes. Then try to start the generator. Normally, the coach batteries are what are used to start the generator. The fact that the generator panel doesn't light means no coach power.
After the engine runs for a few minutes, there should be enough power to at least turn over the generator.
Yes, two 6v deep cycle (golf cart) batteries are proper for your PC. The flooded cell lead-acid provide the most power but also require the most maintenance and can corrode the posts and wires. Maintenance free (AGM) batteries cost more, but require no maintenance and near the the same amount of power.
Yes, charge the batteries.... A 12v charger is fine, positive to the front left terminal where the battery heavy red cable is and the negative terminal of the charger to the back right side terminal where the heavy black battery cables are attached.
Once they are charged, your generator should start.
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Thank you so much. I will head out to storage tomorrow and try your suggestions.
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RV showed 13.4 on the Inverter when I got to storage. Drove RV home 10 miles so some additional charge. Light came on generator button when I tried to start. Didn't start and light went out. Tried to turn on water pump and light but got nothing. Seems like there is a disconnect between battery and power getting to anything in coach.
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RV showed 13.4 on the Inverter when I got to storage. Drove RV home 10 miles so some additional charge. Light came on generator button when I tried to start. Didn't start and light went out. Tried to turn on water pump and light but got nothing. Seems like there is a disconnect between battery and power getting to anything in coach.
The 13.4v on the inverter was when the engine was running.. Correct?
I didn't say 10 minutes charge would allow you to start the generator, I said it should try to start it, the fact that the red light came on was "proof" your coach battery's state of charge was quite low.
Presuming you have water in your fresh water tank, very low voltage would cause light to come on but not enough power to actually run the pump.
Charge your coach batteries as fully as you can... You should be able to start generator.
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The 13.4 was without the engine running. We are charging the battery now.
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http://all-about-lead-acid-batteries.capnfatz.com/all-about-lead-acid-batteries/lead-acid-battery-maintenance/how-to-check-a-battery-with-a-hydrometer/
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The 13.4 was without the engine running. We are charging the battery now.
A fully charged lead-acid battery will measure 12.7 to 12.8 volts max. The 13.4v you reported is a charging voltage that is only available when the engine is running or you are plugged into shore power. However, batteries that are just taken off of a charger will have what is known as a surface charge that results from the chemistry and configuration of a lead-acid battery. That surface charge goes away fairly quickly. So I am guessing you had just (within a few minutes) shut the engine off when you checked the inverter voltage.
Just an FYI.. I have started the generator in my 2551 just using the engine battery. The coach batteries were removed. You have to leave the engine running and you have to wait about a minute or two after you start the engine.
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We were able to get the Genny running using the white rocker button on the dash while the engine was running. It ran great with a load and kept running fine after I turned the engine off. So, it looks like the Genny is not the problem. I shut the Genny off and tried to restart as you normally would. It was a no go.....also no lights, pump, etc. The battery is still charged up just fine so I think there is a problem with the battery cut off switch or a relay or connection. I think this is going to be an RV tech fix.
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In our 2007 PC, when I use the kill-all switch by the main entry door, a solenoid is tripped. We hear it well by making a loud "CLICK". The thing resembles this, though the quality of connections may differ. If you don't hear the "CLICK", maybe that thing is faulty. I would tap it with a hammer to jolt it loose, but NOT to dent it. If you fixed it, then you need to replace it.
(https://i5.walmartimages.com/asr/fbfb9291-da36-4055-8da6-a556c6b65274_1.a590f1fa3b7fe46756e61f1d843847af.jpeg?odnWidth=undefined&odnHeight=undefined&odnBg=ffffff)
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Thanks for all the help. Thought I should let you know how it all worked out. I took the RV in to my RV guys this morning. Initially thought it was solenoid or relay but checked out the batteries first. They were both fine. Checked out the battery cutoff. It was fine. Tracked it to a problem with the ground. Under RV, the ground wire was just barely movable. Re-established the connection to the frame the a new bolt and those star connectors. Thirty minutes after arrival, all the DC power was working fine and generator started right up and I was on my way home. What a relief. Heading out Friday morning on a month long trip. Thanks again.
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First dry camping dry camping with the PC love it. however a glitch always happens and it goes like this battery looks full I go to start the generator and it kills the whole electrical system. I have to put jumper cables from the engine battery to the house batteries and then the generator starts. I think my problem is my batteries are too dead and they were indicating 11.7. any help I'd appreciate it thank you
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Hi Mark,
Yes, it seems you need a new pair of house batteries. If the battery voltage drops quickly from 11.7 volts while trying to start, they are surely dead.
When replacing your batteries, I advise to consider a pair of 6V AGM batteries. I found the 6Vs work much better together than 12Vs do. Because 6V batteries are taller than 12V, I had an interference problem in my 2007 battery compartment. So I replaced the raised battery tray with a flat stock metal bottom and bought a pair of maintenance free 6V AGM batteries. I installed them in 2015 and they remain there today in great shape.
CLICK HERE (https://forum.phoenixusarv.com/index.php?topic=2092.0) for my write-up on changing to 6V AGM batteries.
CLICK HERE (https://www.flickr.com/photos/37432012@N08/albums/72157622075091526) for pictures of my battery compartment splash shield to protect them from tire splash. I am not sure if your 2008 PC model 2900 has the same condition as my 2007 model 2350.
A battery tray is an absolute requirement to maintain acid levels. So if going with wet acid 6Vs. you will need to replace your battery compartment frame with a taller one that hangs down lower. I think Phoenix has them available. Keep in-mind that doing so, the battery frame will hang below your battery compartment door by 2 extra inches, a simple cosmetic issue alone.
Whether 6V wet acid or 6V AGM, going from two 12V to two 6V batteries will greatly improve your power reserves for your house when camping for multiple days without shore power, and two 6V batteries live twice as long as two 12V batteries with less acid boil-over messes to deal with all the time. AGMs simply don't boil over. They stay clean, clean terminals, acid-free, and maintenance free. I went through two pairs of wet acid 12V batteries that provided us with only two good years of service each. One of my best improvements made to our PC was going to two 6V AGM batteries. Six years so far and all is well.
I have to add that converting out our florescent and incandescent lighting to LEDs also helped with our battery reserves. CLICK HERE (https://forum.phoenixusarv.com/index.php/topic,2186.0.html) to read all about it.