Cruisers Forum
Main Forum => General Discussion => Topic started by: frecklestweety on October 22, 2014, 03:39:47 pm
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Well had 2010 2551 mh winterized and asked my RV service to check on my tires. As I see it they were mfg. 0808 so they are six yrs old. He said they show very slight dry rot and will pass inspection in the spring. They have plenty of tread and seem ok but I am thinking that it is time to get new tires. I know there has been many discussions on this topic and really up to the individual to make the decision on what to do. So for safety sake do you think it is time to get new and would like to get Michelin's and my rv service said they can get them. Of course my tires were not on the recall as mentioned in other forum discussions.
The next thing is coach batteries and they are the original ones. They are so hard to read the water level and was wondering if they are replaced as to what is a better battery. My MH will be stored in Pole Barn and I have been told you can leave it plugged in all the time to keep the batteries charged but afraid they could be overcharged. I keep little nite lites on to use some of the power but not sure what is right. Any suggestions on the questions???
This forum has always been so helpful.
So sorry I missed the reunion. Looking forward to next year. Already in the calendar.
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Our rig is a 2007 model year with tires dated spring of 2007. Like you, we keep our rig indoors away from sunlight but I have no plan anytime soon to replace the tires. Given your rig is a 2551, it is on the lighter side of motor homes so there is less tire pressure and less weight on the tires so the demand on them is less. I would think you would be fine getting one more year from them and evaluate again one year from next spring.
Regarding batteries, assumed no winter camping plans, I would charge them and bring them into your house out from the extreme cold. The same for the chassis battery. Fill your main fuel tank up, blow out all water lines, drain all four water tanks, place numerous rodent traps around inside and abandon the rig until preparing for your first trip next year.
Next spring, I plan to replace our 5 year old 12V Walmart batteries with 6V Duracell batteries from Sam's Club. I did some measuring and determined that my slide out battery tray will need to be replaced with a simple sheet of steel to get adequate clearance because the 6V batteries are so much taller. The sheet steel will have angle iron screwed to it to cradle the batteries so they don't move around on the large surface.
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Yesterday I saw a Phoenix Cruiser here in Honey Brook Pa that looked like it could have been a 2010 Beige 2551........just curious if it happened to be you?? My wife said she saw a similar coach last week at our bank.
Dave
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Our rig is a 2007 model year with tires dated spring of 2007. Like you, we keep our rig indoors away from sunlight but I have no plan anytime soon to replace the tires. Given your rig is a 2551, it is on the lighter side of motor homes so there is less tire pressure and less weight on the tires so the demand on them is less. I would think you would be fine getting one more year from them and evaluate again one year from next spring.
Regarding batteries, assumed no winter camping plans, I would charge them and bring them into your house out from the extreme cold. The same for the chassis battery. Fill your main fuel tank up, blow out all water lines, drain all four water tanks, place numerous rodent traps around inside and abandon the rig until preparing for your first trip next year.
Next spring, I plan to replace our 5 year old 12V Walmart batteries with 6V Duracell batteries from Sam's Club. I did some measuring and determined that my slide out battery tray will need to be replaced with a simple sheet of steel to get adequate clearance because the 6V batteries are so much taller. The sheet steel will have angle iron screwed to it to cradle the batteries so they don't move around on the large surface.
Thanks for the tips. My Pole barn doesn't get below freezing and always kept mh there and never had any problems with the batteries. I would like to get another year on the tires.
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Yesterday I saw a Phoenix Cruiser here in Honey Brook Pa that looked like it could have been a 2010 Beige 2551........just curious if it happened to be you?? My wife said she saw a similar coach last week at our bank.
Dave
Yes it was me. I was at Millers RV for winterizing. Last week I was camping with RVWomen at York Fairgrounds and believe it or not there were two other Phoenix cruisers. Something you don't always see.
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Freckles--I was in that part of PA at the end of Sept and met a couple of the ladies from that group at the small campground I was staying at. If I had taken them up on their invitation to attend the rally, there would have been FOUR PCs there. Maybe next year!
Carol
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Freckles--I was in that part of PA at the end of Sept and met a couple of the ladies from that group at the small campground I was staying at. If I had taken them up on their invitation to attend the rally, there would have been FOUR PCs there. Maybe next year!
Carol
Their next convention is October 2015 in Shawnee Oklahoma. there are many chapters all over the US and I'M with Mid-Atlantic Chapter and have one more trip November 7th in Lancaster for the weekend at the Old Mill Stream Campground. It is their annual Thanksgiving feast. After that the MH goes to bed until March.
They have a Solo's chapter which I am considering joining next season. Most are widows like me and travel solo. Very Friendly group like Cruisers.
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Thanks for the info, Frecklestweety, and I hope your PC's last Fall trip is wonderful. Drive safely!
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I did some measuring and determined that my slide out battery tray will need to be replaced with a simple sheet of steel to get adequate clearance because the 6V batteries are so much taller. The sheet steel will have angle iron screwed to it to cradle the batteries so they don't move around on the large surface.
In my planning to accommodate taller 6V batteries, I am wondering how Phoenix accommodates their tall 6V batteries in their new PCs.
Are the tall 6V batteries still in a slide out tray or simply placed on a flat metal compartment bottom like I will have to fabricate to get adequate clearence?
If tall 6Vs still sit in a slide out tray, did the factory lower the compartment for the batteries to clear the top of the finished opening?
If so, do you see the sliding tray below the closed battery door?
In my current 12V situation seen here, when the finished door is closed, I only see a portion of that 1" high horizontal black angle iron below the door.
To you who have tall 6V batteries, what do you see below the battery door after it is closed?
(https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3495/3841153525_3487c92500_z.jpg)
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Ron why don't you call the factory and ask them and if they used a different tray, how you might get one?
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Ron, They just dropped the tray about 1-1/2". Slides in/out without any clearance problem.
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My 12V tray is raised. I can modify it to be so low that it will scrape the frame. If I drop it to within 1/8" of the frame to avoid scraping, I don't think the battery terminals will clear the top of the opening. It seems that close a call. Also, I would like to place the batteries inside the tray so they are as far forward to me (not the back wall) to relax my battery cabling better. That might require a new tray of different dimensions. You are right Tom. I should call the factory.
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I just got off the phone with Kermit.
Phoenix extended the battery box frame by the amount required to accommodate the taller 6V batteries which is 1.5 inches. That means I either have to lower my battery frame somehow (maybe using 1.5" "U" channel) or replace my battery tray with a flat piece of sheet steel as I had figured. Kermit said the battery box frame is bolted to the floor of the PC which makes using "U" channel a consideration.
At least I know what my options are.
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Freckles
Tires-- I have tires that will be 8years old next summer 15,,,,,, they show some small cracking on the side wall and looked great I have 21000 miles on them,,,, how ever they are coming off this winter as much as I hate it, especially the cost... Tons of info on the forum re tires etc,,,, were going to Alaska in the spring it's a 11k mile trip.. does not matter they would still come off.. manufacturers have lots of info re tire life,,, but for peace of mind and to just to be safe I'm re-tiring hehe..... were going to make a break-in trip prior to our Alaska trip My research shows that I probably will go with the same Michellins
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If your tires look great with real good thread, check a local charity that takes in vehicles. They might accept your 4 best tires as a donation to put on a work van that was received with really bad tires. That is my plan when it comes time.
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Hey great ideal Ron,,, yeah we have those charities donate you car etc will check that out great suggestion
sparky
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Well had 2010 2551 mh winterized and asked my RV service to check on my tires. As I see it they were mfg. 0808 so they are six yrs old. He said they show very slight dry rot and will pass inspection in the spring. They have plenty of tread and seem ok but I am thinking that it is time to get new tires. I know there has been many discussions on this topic and really up to the individual to make the decision on what to do. So for safety sake do you think it is time to get new and would like to get Michelin's and my rv service said they can get them. Of course my tires were not on the recall as mentioned in other forum discussions.
The next thing is coach batteries and they are the original ones. They are so hard to read the water level and was wondering if they are replaced as to what is a better battery. My MH will be stored in Pole Barn and I have been told you can leave it plugged in all the time to keep the batteries charged but afraid they could be overcharged. I keep little nite lites on to use some of the power but not sure what is right. Any suggestions on the questions???
This forum has always been so helpful.
So sorry I missed the reunion. Looking forward to next year. Already in the calendar.
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Well had 2010 2551 mh winterized and asked my RV service to check on my tires. As I see it they were mfg. 0808 so they are six yrs old. He said they show very slight dry rot and will pass inspection in the spring. They have plenty of tread and seem ok but I am thinking that it is time to get new tires. I know there has been many discussions on this topic and really up to the individual to make the decision on what to do. So for safety sake do you think it is time to get new and would like to get Michelin's and my rv service said they can get them. Of course my tires were not on the recall as mentioned in other forum discussions.
The next thing is coach batteries and they are the original ones. They are so hard to read the water level and was wondering if they are replaced as to what is a better battery. My MH will be stored in Pole Barn and I have been told you can leave it plugged in all the time to keep the batteries charged but afraid they could be overcharged. I keep little nite lites on to use some of the power but not sure what is right. Any suggestions on the questions???
This forum has always been so helpful.
So sorry I missed the reunion. Looking forward to next year. Already in the calendar.
Decided to get new tires in the Spring of 15. Got a price from local Michelin Dealer and they are going to be $210. a tire plus mounting and balancing for about $25 a tire. I thought they would cost a lot more but the dealer works with FMCA advantage program and they could cost me less. He said these tires are standard tires and has them all the time. I will check on the year of the tire was mfg when I purchase them...Since the MH will be garaged for the winter, we will wait till spring. I just don't want to take a chance on six to eight year old tires. Safety first and an ounce of prevention is worth a thousand cures they say.
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If you'll take some advice from a 25+ year RV owner, but not yet a PC owner, it's time for tires. You're pretty close to the max time tire manufacturers recommend keeping them. But one suggestion, don't purchase the Michelins through your RV service guys without pricing them from Discount Tire Direct, http://www.discounttiredirect.com/direct/home.do
or a Discount Tire store if you have any locally. Direct can ship them to your service guy if you want.
Another good source, a bit more expensive is The Tire Rack, https://www.tirerack.com/
they can also ship wherever.
Who knows, you might be able to get your service guys to match the price, and they will be fresher tires most likely.
On the batteries, you might check out AGM batteries for replacement. They are sealed with no servicing required, but considerably more expensive. Can't help you with specific models since I don't know what your OEM batteries are.....
Good luck
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I have dealt with Discount Tire for 20 plus years and have never had a bad experience. A great benefit is that Discount Tire offers free rotation on all installed tires.
I had our PC tires replaced under the recent recall and when I picked up the PC Discount Tire confirmed they would rotate the tires on the PC free. The only thing they asked is that I call ahead and make an appointment because of the added time required from the dual wheels.
Here is a link to the Discount Tire website for Mechelin tires:
http://www.discounttire.com/dtcs/cart/addToCart.do?productTypeId=1&v=024783%7C2010&r=MBRINT&productId=14048
Barry
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On the batteries, you might check out AGM batteries for replacement. They are sealed with no servicing required, but considerably more expensive. Can't help you with specific models since I don't know what your OEM batteries are.....
Good luck
Just last night I was working on our battery compartment, fabricating a steel bottom after removing the slide out battery tray to gain enough clearance for a pair of the taller 6V batteries. Maintenance-free AGMs seems the smarter choice now that the slide-out tray is gone. I'll be buying the AGMs at Sam's Club at $180/battery.
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Ron do you know how long AGM batteries last? I know that regular flooded batteries are sold by cranking amps and number of months they should last, ie 36, 48 or 60 months. Are AGMs the same way?
The reason we remove old tires is because they might have a blow out. I disagree with putting them on another vehicle, even a lighter one. It was a nice through but I would not do it myself.
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Ron do you know how long AGM batteries last? I know that regular flooded batteries are sold by cranking amps and number of months they should last, ie 36, 48 or 60 months. Are AGMs the same way?
I'll stick my nose in here again with an answer. If all is well with your converter, as in optimized for lead acid as well as AGM, modern multistage chargers are best here, AGM's have the capability of doubling the life of an equal sized lead acid.
Now of course this means the AGM's have to be top quality in the first place. I know one brand of AGM, Optima, has suffered the last few years from quality problems as reported on multiple Jeep forums
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My thought about batteries, 12v versus 6V versus 6V-AGM, I am simply stepping off the battery diving board to find out how deep and how warm the water is untested. I'm setting up my battery compartment for the taller 6V batteries, choosing AGM for what I hope will be a better experience. You'll have to ask me in 5 years how I like them.
My reconfiguration is easy to revert back to 12v with slide-out battery tray, bolt-in-bolt-out for both the tray and steel plate 6V box bottom. All of 5 minutes to switch back from 6V to 12V if I ever want to.
Regarding the donated tires....
Tom, if you saw the tires on work vans that get donated to the charity I volunteer in, you would surely agree that retired PC tires are so much safer. Some donated vans are so bad that the steel belts have come through the rubber. Most donated work vans are very tired, some have sat unused for many years out in the elements before being donated to a charity. I think they are driven into the ground after they get used up to a certain point, then parked when it's past due for tires.
If the charity determines the van is worth selling to the general public, they want to sell a safe vehicle. It doesn't have to be perfect, just safe & reliable as can be expected under the circumstances and price window. Decent used motor home tires provides a means for that to work. If the charity bought new tires along with addressing other issues on a van and sold it for $900, then what was there to gain? Receiving good used tires from people like us PC owners, helps the charity get reliable work vehicles in the hands of people who can't afford better, and the proceeds help other people in other ways. It's good for everyone involved. Even the PC owner gets a tax write-off of some amount.
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Now I understand. Thanks Ron.
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Now I understand. Thanks Ron.
:)
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Barry
Looked at your link I'm pricing now,,, ouch,,,,,,, Did you do a tire alignment???
sparky
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Barry
Looked at your link I'm pricing now,,, ouch,,,,,,, Did you do a tire alignment???
sparky
That is why I am not in any hurry to replace our tires.
Understandably, some members have more wealth then others as reflected in tire replacement and even PC replacement duration. Some members are on PC #3 in less time than Irene and I with PC #1 & only forever. We simply don't have the financial resources to replace our rig or even the tires like that.
Don't misunderstand my point. Irene and I are so blessed with what we have. I am not complaining here at all. It is good to see others enjoying life so abundantly. They can afford to reduce tire risk like that of which I say "Good For Them". But for us, I hope to go through one set of tires in the time and/or miles that others go through two sets. Each owner has their own idea of what is considered safe, and "Low" risk. Some follow the tire manufacture recommendations and I don't put that down at all. But for us considering the way we store our lighter weighted rig, I consider my plan to be of "Low" risk. I would not give it any thought to an Alaska trip with our 7 year old 24,000 mile tires. But again, that is just me. I am not advising anyone to follow along.
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Sparky
I had the front end aligned when we first got the PC. After we had the tires replaced under the Michelin recall I didn't notice any change in handling and did not have a front end alignment done.
Barry
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Here is some useable information when looking for replacement batteries. On a previous RV, I had AGM batteries and the in house charger had to be set for the AGM vs. Wet Cell.
Bob
Wet Cell (flooded), Gel Cell, and Absorbed Glass Mat (AGM) are various versions of the lead acid battery. The Wet cell comes in two styles; Serviceable and Maintenance free. Both are filled with electrolyte and are basically the same. I prefer one that I can add water to and check the specific gravity of the electrolyte with a hydrometer. The Gel Cell and the AGM batteries are specialty batteries that typically cost twice as much as a premium wet cell. However they store very well and do not tend to sulfate or degrade as easily as wet cell. There is little chance of a hydrogen gas explosion or corrosion when using these batteries; these are the safest lead acid batteries you can use. Gel Cell and some AGM batteries may require a special charging rate. If you want the best,most versatile type, consideration should be given to the AGM battery for applications such as Marine, RV, Solar, Audio, Power Sports and Stand-By Power just to name a few. If you don't use or operate your equipment daily, AGM batteries will hold their charge better that other types. If you must depend on top-notch battery performance, spend the extra money. Gel Cell batteries still are being sold but AGM batteries are replacing them in most applications. There is a some common confusion regarding AGM batteries because different manufactures call them by different names; some of the more common names are "sealed regulated valve", "dry cell", "non spillable", and "Valve Regulated Lead Acid" batteries. In most cases AGM batteries will give greater life span and greater cycle life than a wet cell battery.
SPECIAL NOTE about Gel Batteries: It is very common for individuals to use the term GEL CELL when referring to sealed, maintenance free batteries, much like one would use Kleenex when referring to facial tissue or "Xerox machine" when referring to a copy machine. Be very careful when specifying a gel cell battery charger, many times we are told by customer they are requiring a charger for a Gel Cell battery and in fact the battery is not a Gel Cell.
Scorpion BatteryAGM: The Absorbed Glass Matt construction allows the electrolyte to be suspended in close proximity with the plates active material. In theory, this enhances both the discharge and recharge efficiency. Common manufacturer applications include high performance engine starting, power sports, deep cycle, solar and storage battery. The larger AGM batteries we sell are typically good deep cycle batteries and they deliver their best life performance if recharged before allowed to drop below the 50% discharge rate. The Scorpion motorcycle batteries we carry are a nice upgrade from your stock flooded battery, and the Odyssey branded batteries are fantastic for holding their static charge over long periods of non use. When Deep Cycle AGM batteries are discharged to a rate of no less than 60% the cycle life will be 300 plus cycles.
GEL: The Gel Cell is similar to the AGM style because the electrolyte is suspended, but different because technically the AGM battery is still considered to be a wet cell. The electrolyte in a Gel Cell has a silica additive that causes it to set up or stiffen. The recharge voltage on this type of cell is lower than the other styles of lead acid battery. This is probably the most sensitive cell in terms of adverse reactions to over-voltage charging. Gel Batteries are best used in VERY DEEP cycle application and may last a bit longer in hot weather applications. If the incorrect battery charger is used on a Gel Cell battery poor performance and premature failure is certain.
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Freckles
Tires-- I have tires that will be 8years old next summer 15,,,,,, they show some small cracking on the side wall and looked great I have 21000 miles on them,,,, how ever they are coming off this winter as much as I hate it, especially the cost... Tons of info on the forum re tires etc,,,, were going to Alaska in the spring it's a 11k mile trip.. does not matter they would still come off.. manufacturers have lots of info re tire life,,, but for peace of mind and to just to be safe I'm re-tiring hehe..... were going to make a break-in trip prior to our Alaska trip My research shows that I probably will go with the same Michellins
I am replacing my Michelin tires this spring. Got a good price from local dealer in Delaware at $210 a tire plus about 25$ for mounting and balancing each. Plus being a member of FMCA I can get a discount with their Michelin advantage plan which can drop the price a little. I thought they would have cost more than 210 but they are a light duty truck tire and they are standard size. My tires have a date of 2008 and I'm the second owner. I'd rather be safe than sorry.
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Thanks gl1500 for the lesson on batteries.
I decided to go with AGM technology batteries for my 12V/parallel to 6V/series conversion. Due to national availability and price, I plan to purchase Two Of These (http://www.samsclub.com/sams/duracell-agm-golf-car-battery-group-size-gc2agm/prod3870119.ip) from Sam's Club.
Do you have an opinion on them?
Thanks!
Ron
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Barry
Understand,,,, we have had our unit for two years,,, used,,,, purchased it in Seattle had it delivered to Vegas where we picked it up... were from Houston..... To be honest I could afford a new unit,, but I'm such a cheap *&^* haha,,, no we got such a good deal and a little research shows how easy with a little patience you can find a GREAT RV... our first RV was a Roadtrek,,, I had the tires rotated messed the alignment all up BTW could not feel a thing when driving... so I pay a lot attention to new tires, alignment etc,,, when I get the new tires will do an alignment,, not rotation,, but keep a hawk eye on the treads,,, speaking of doing things,, all my neighbors hate me I'm the only one around here who still mows their own yard.I keep seeing all the crews hanging Xmas lights,, guess it's time to get the ladder out. haha
sparky
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speaking of doing things,, all my neighbors hate me I'm the only one around here who still mows their own yard.
sparky
Same here, but out of financial necessity.
I designed our house and with great luck was able to build in a neighborhood where ours is the least of them. After all, someone with a fitting home had to be at the bottom. We don't officially fit in with the class of doctors, lawyers, & successful business owners around us, but we fit in every other way, the result of everyone working to assure there are no social barriers. It is a great place to call home with so many good neighbors who understand who we are and appreciate our determination in keeping a nice home well maintained. They seem to be entertained at times with our determination in avoiding services.
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OK. I admit it: I got lazy and for the first time in my life am having someone else do my yard work. Well, not quite. They do the front and I still do the back. We have almost an acre and it is heavily landscaped out front with the back being left mostly woods for the critters and privacy it affords us. I fix most things myself and have always done so. RV wise, I have never taken one in thirty years of rving to a dealer (I don't mean the chassis, I mean the coach stuff) for repair or maintenance. Part of the hobby for me is doing the RV and everything else myself.
When we got the 2350 and gave up our Roadtrek a little over a year ago, we decided it was time not to be a slave to the yard. It gets darn hot in OKC in the summer and we wanted to be able to just load up and go up to the mountains for weeks at a time. And we did this year. Seventy degree days at 9000 feet sure feel better to my seventy year old body than 100 degrees here at home. Finally putting our yard out to someone else's care may be one of the greatest luxuries in my life. A good friend owns the company that takes care of it. I still enjoy the back area maintenance but if it is left to its own for a month, it really doesn't create a problem.
Next: I am going to learn to call a plumber instead of doing it myself. I hate it and never have been good at it.
Ron, the link to the batteries you are buying at Sams is interesting. I buy all my batteries at Sams, but if you look on down in the link you see something interesting. The ones you decided to go with are not available at Sams in the South or west of the Mississippi. I suspect that is either because of limited production at a plant somewhere in the NE quadrant of the country or just transportation cost and a more limited demand product.
In any event, after adding 200 watts of Renogy panels on the roof this year, next spring I am going with two golf car sixes. I had them on our Roadtrek and replaced the OEM after six years with two from Sams, but I would really like to use the AGMs. I could, I am sure buy similar batteries close by. In any event I look forward to your educational posts and appreciate your PC knowledge. Please keep us up to date on this project. After boondocking with the PC dual 12s for a year, I really look forward to a couple of sixes. Believe me, you will enjoy the difference in capacity.
Paul
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Well had 2010 2551 mh winterized and asked my RV service to check on my tires. As I see it they were mfg. 0808 so they are six yrs old. He said they show very slight dry rot and will pass inspection in the spring. They have plenty of tread and seem ok but I am thinking that it is time to get new tires. I know there has been many discussions on this topic and really up to the individual to make the decision on what to do. So for safety sake do you think it is time to get new and would like to get Michelin's and my rv service said they can get them. Of course my tires were not on the recall as mentioned in other forum discussions.
The next thing is coach batteries and they are the original ones. They are so hard to read the water level and was wondering if they are replaced as to what is a better battery. My MH will be stored in Pole Barn and I have been told you can leave it plugged in all the time to keep the batteries charged but afraid they could be overcharged. I keep little nite lites on to use some of the power but not sure what is right. Any suggestions on the questions???
This forum has always been so helpful.
So sorry I missed the reunion. Looking forward to next year. Already in the calendar.
Will be replacing tires in spring. Michelin Dealer in Delaware quote me $210 a tire plus $25 per tire for mounting and balancing. Plus they cooperate with FMCA advantage program.
Also. what causes acid to build up on the strap that holds the batteries. It is not on the batteries but on the clip of the strap???? I checked them the other day and a couple chambers needed water and so I filled them with distilled water. But don't know why the chalky stuff builds up on the strap. :)
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But don't know why the chalky stuff builds up on the strap
What we do to prevent this is disconnect everything, clean everythiing with baking soda and water, this removes all old corrosion build up. We then reconnect everything and coat all metal with vaseline.
There are many commercial products out there for cleaning and protective sprays but we find this has worked the best for us. We make sure to only fill our battery chambers to not more than 1/4 inch above the plates.
Many times this chalky stuff is a result of the batteries being over charged.